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>> Paging councilmember Burroughs.

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Please take a seat.
Good evening folks.

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How are you all doing tonight?

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Good I like a quiet crowd. Good decorum.

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In that regard unless you are cheering teacher no

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cheering, booing throwing stuff like that let's all be

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on good behavior tonight.
It is my pleasure to be church of the Prince George's

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County I am Thomas Dernoga and the chair of the

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transportation infrastructure, energy and environment

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committee we have put together this town hall meeting.

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All the Council members have heard constituents,

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business owners, raised concerns about how things work

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at the department. Without one of the best things we

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could do is open up the floor and hear from you.

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We have gotten a lot of emails for tonight's meeting.
We have numerous responses to our survey those who took

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our survey. By show of hands how many people took the
survey?
Any of you but not all of you you could do that online.

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Hopefully the flyer has the link. We want a handle of

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what people are thinking with the problems and

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challenges. I do not want to pull this up we look like

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a long evening in terms of people signed up.

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Because of the prior meetings no one pays attention to the timer. It is in front of you this time. I am supposed to run it. I don't know how to do this

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you might get just over two minutes because I don't

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know what I am doing. When it hits 0 please wrap up. It

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makes a noise but I will make another nice. I will turn

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it over to Mr. Olson to orient us.

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>> ERIC C. OLSON: Very interested in hearing people's

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experiences your thoughts on, you know, the Department

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of Homeland inspection. I think all of us have heard

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from business owners community leaders and residents.

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You know, about some of the things that you would like

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improved. We have the time now where we will be getting

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a new director. And this is an opportune time to, you

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know, talk with us about some of the things you are

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seeing. And your perspective on things. And this

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counsel wants to listen to our residents, business

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owners. We have an open door policy. To give us your

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few. So with that I note that we have department here.

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Leaders of the department.
Including DC 80 McCarthy. I think the alternative at

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this point and appreciate you and your team being here.

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>> Sure, good evening it is great is everyone on this

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evening all of our customers as well as residents of

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the county that turned out. I am Jared McCarthy at the

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deputy chief administrative officer for government

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operations. As you have heard I've had the pleasure

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currently of serving as the acting director DPOD of as

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many of you may not know the former director has

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transitioned out of employment with the County

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government after serving four years. I do want to take

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a moment to acknowledge Ms.

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BowliBowling she led through the pandemic which in and

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of itself was no small feat. We will talk about that a

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little bit more.
But really she started a number of new programs and

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really modernized DPIE ways we are starting to see

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forward and will continue to implement some of those

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processes and changes that she was really the architect

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for. I just want to give her that acknowledgment and

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certainly wish her best on her new career. I also do

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want to take a moment to acknowledge the two deputy

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directors here with us tonight. We are certainly

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available to answer questions as the chair deems fit.

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As well as after the fact. On behalf of us Mr. Abraham

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if you would raise your hand. There we go we also have

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with us Mr. Lamont Hinton is the deputy director. As

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many of you may or may not know DowaDowart is a fixture

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he has been with DPIE the government almost 40 years.

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So we certainly thank you him for his breadth of

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knowledge and experience and he is certainly one of

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those men who can talk intelligently on any subject

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with DPIE. Lamont on the other hand has been here six

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months and we are hoping he will scare him away today.

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I want to thank you Lamont he joined us from DC

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government. We certainly have high hopes for Lamont he

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has come in with a critical eye with the outsider look.

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And has really brought a breath of fresh air to us but

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certainly I want to acknowledge his presence and thank

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you him. We have a number of other DPIE employees in

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the crowd I will not acknowledge each and every one of

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them. I would ask them to stand just so the crowd has

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an idea of who is here from DPIE. These are many of the

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senior managers. They are certainly going to be

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available after to answer questions as well. Or address

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any particular questions. Thank you team for spending

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your night with us as well. So I do want to take a

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moment we will run through a little bit of DPIE

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history. A little bit of what it does. We will not take

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a lot of time because we really want to hear from you.

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But we want to orient the crowd to what it is DPIE

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does. Its mission and the expensive nature of how it

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operates in county government.
It is one of the bigger agencies behind the public

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safety agencies.
With that we will go on.

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As you know there are a number of divisions. That

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mainly revolve around those divisions that do

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permitting. That do plan review versus those that do

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inspections and enforcement. So the key initiative for

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DPIE as well as its mission statement is really create

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a high-quality customer friendly experience for the

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permit applicant, and others that are required to do

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business in front of DPIE. As you heard when Ms. Boling

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came on she came in on a period when DPIE was in

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transition. The prior director had (that position had

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been vacant several months and DPIE was doing a number

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of legacy computer systems that required change. And

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certainly that is one of the key initiatives we are

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following her on. Is to really use technology to

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streamline our processes. And certainly we are always

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looking to simplify instructions and enforcement. Next

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slide. The permitting and license division is what you

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would expect it to be a one-stop shop for all the

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permits required in the county.

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For issuance of your building permits. Some licenses

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are required for businesses in the county. And if you

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would acquire a license a special event permit things

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of that nature. One of the developments that was put in

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place during COVID and one we are very proud of is the

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business development section. We took a couple of

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positions and really dedicated them to the small

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entrepreneur. And to date these two team members. You

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will see Charles Cooper and Nicole Reese with her

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contact information there. And the PowerPoint will

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ultimately be available through the County website as

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well. They work with our entrepreneurs on a regular

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basis. They have helped over 130 businesses so far. And

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this is really designed for the small mom and pop

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business. The one that has difficulty navigating the

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system.
Let's pause there.

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And what I mean by that is big developers know how to

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navigate the system they have the resources. They have

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the manpower, they have all of the consultants they

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need. But what we really find is the small I want to

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open a restaurant. I want to open a small clothes shop.

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Those businesses really have difficulty understanding

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all of the permitting requirements. And that is really

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necessary especially as a food service industry. As you

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can imagine you have to touch so many agencies to be

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able to open a food service industry. And these two

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individuals are designed to guide you through that

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process. So with DPIE connect is another one of those

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programs we put into place. And this again is designed

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for small businesses but it is a one hour meeting where

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we will sit you down with DPIE professionals and you

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can see the requirements.
Again, this is not designed for big developer or the

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big MGM will come in and build another building. This

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is designed for projects doing a straight use and

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occupancy permit change.
Meeting you bought a business, you are doing the exact

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same business I was already there.

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You are a restaurant going into a restaurant space. And you just need to change the name of your business. That requires a permit something a lot of people don't understand. But that is what this group is designed to do. And you see we do other things. Change of occupancy with no construction.

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Interior alterations of no less than 3000 ft. at

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projects not more than one story in height.

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And we will help the small businesses are any applicant

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free of charge with this program if you meet those

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qualifications.
Next slide. The next division we are going to go over his building
plan review.
And the name is what he was expected to be.

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These are the plans for when you will build on a rock piece of land or a pad site. Where you will do either horizontal development.

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That is when clearing the land putting infrastructure

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in.
And vertical when you are going up above the ground

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level.
They do all the reviews you would imagine you have

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structural, mechanical, fire protection, electrical.
All of the basic reviews you would imagine is required

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to make sure we have high-quality development in this

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county.
And these are the engineers and DPIE that look at the

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plans submitted by your design professionals.
Whether they are architects, engineers.

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And this is the group that will review all those plans.

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And really make sure your whole project comes together

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in the issue the final building permits.

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So I won't go over this in large detail.

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But wanted you to see this is the permit application process. This is a flowchart for how long things take on

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average.
These are some of the metrics we try to pick.

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And you can see when doing vertical and horizontal

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development it takes a while.

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You will be in this process it is months, weeks

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depending on how well your designs are, when they are

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submitted.
Meaning how complete, how many review cycles they need to go through. How many different reviews you have to do. It putting in elevators that is an added layer. Then if you have a one story or two story building. Again this will be available in the PowerPoint we just

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wanted to provide it so you have some concept of the

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process. So site wrote the plan review division.

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This is all of the infrastructure that goes in under

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your project. This is all of what makes daily life

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actually comfortable and enjoyable. Meaning this is

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your stormwater management. This is making sure the

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infrastructure thatSSC is working as it is designed

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for. This is your road and transportation. For many of

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those in South County and certainly River towns this is

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the group that makes sure the flooding does not occur

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in existing streets as new developments go in. One of

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the reasons we highlight this group is this group is

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the one that everything else that is built is owned by

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the owner. And it is important for US citizens to know

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if this is the exception.

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Because the owner of a piece of property puts the

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infrastructure but they turn it over to the county when

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it is done. The county inherits all of this

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infrastructure that may be built by an owner. And

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ultimately it is the county's obligation for the rest

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of time to maintain that infrastructure.

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Again, this is an area we pay particular attention to

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make sure we are getting high-quality development. And

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make sure all the plans and specs are according to

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code. Next slide.
The inspections division, again.

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The inspections division is exactly what it sounds

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like, again. This is inspections for construction this

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is not inspections for enforcement.

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That will be the next division. This is the division that comes out there once you have

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built your project and you are in the course of

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building. They come out and to all of those inspections

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that are necessary to ensure health and safety. The

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life safety code. All of those codes that are approved

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by national agencies or code councils. They are the

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ones that come out and check the box, make sure you are

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doing everything correctly. And as you can imagine on a

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very big project.
Say a building of this size there will be multiple

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inspections. They will come out and they will look at

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when the wiring is done but 20 elevators are uploaded.

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They will look at when you're HVAC. You can imagine

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this is a very busy group. They are roughly seven to

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ten days out on inspections meaning when you called

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inspection intake 7-ten days to get scheduled. And we

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will talk about the volume. One of the things we are

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most proud of during COVID is a virtual inspection

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program. And I think as citizens you should understand

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that your County was one of the first counties in the

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entire country to stand up a virtual inspection

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program. The leaders of this division met with the

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International code Council. Again that is one of the

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trade organizations that established building codes

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that counties across the nation adoptadopt. Some of you

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who have been around today have some great in here here

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may remember it as bocboca Once upon a time they met

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with the international code coucouncil and with Las

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Vegas, Phoenix and Tampa as to how during the mix of

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COVID.
When people could not be around each other when we were

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social distancing. When we were wearing mask plus how

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we will keep construction going in the county. Because

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as you remember the governor had declared construction
was an essential function and must continue during

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COVID.
In April 2020. And as we all remember. It was good old

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Friday the 13th. Many of us were sent home some of us

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have not returned to the office sense.

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Barely a month, month and a half later that a program,

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stood up where they could keep construction and

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inspections going. For me that is laudable it shows the

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technical skills of the employees working at DPIE.

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And the like they were willing to go to to keep things going. Next slide. Enforcement division I think this is what one of our

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citizens have the most contact with. As it says these

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are the folks you call when Rusty cars in your

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neighbors yard. When somebody has taken their driveway

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and extended it beyond its normal size and now the

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whole front yard look like a driveway. This is who you

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call when there are high weeds and trash and things

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like that. The inspection division enforce the codes.

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They enforce the zoning code, the housing code the

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property maintenance and standard code.
All of these are interrelated but they have slightly

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different paths. We won't go through each and every one

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of these but we will give you the top ten frequent code

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violations. Why don't you go back. I will just go

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through the top three. These are the ones we hear the

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most about operating a business. We get more complaints

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for that.
The only other thing is trash and debris. That means

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that.
Performing automotive work in a driveway. Or on a

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street they are frequent complaints. Many folks they

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operate small businesses auto repair out of their home.

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Something in a residential neighborhood others the

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neighbors. And it is not an easy issue to address but

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it is unpermitted construction in the county. There are

00:19:25.297 --> 00:19:27.297
a lot of different variations from decks that are not

00:19:30.336 --> 00:19:32.336
permitted to fences people built. To hold interior

00:19:34.340 --> 00:19:36.340
renovation that the only way people know is Stacey

00:19:38.844 --> 00:19:40.844
materials going in and out. These are the top three the

00:19:44.383 --> 00:19:46.383
slides will be available. Certainly want you to be

00:19:48.921 --> 00:19:50.921
aware of them. How do we communicate to the public?

00:19:53.926 --> 00:19:55.926
I think that is something DPIE can do a better job

00:19:56.962 --> 00:19:58.962
with. We want to thank you the Council again for this

00:19:59.999 --> 00:20:01.999
invitation to appear here tonight. Three times a year

00:20:02.468 --> 00:20:04.468
we do community partner meetings along with DOE which

00:20:04.970 --> 00:20:06.970
is the Department of environment and environment of

00:20:07.173 --> 00:20:08.706
public works.
These three agencies DPIE, COBOE, and public works at

00:20:12.411 --> 00:20:14.411
the primary agencies responsible for all litter and

00:20:16.615 --> 00:20:18.615
trash controls. In the county. They correlate among

00:20:20.786 --> 00:20:22.786
themselves because they have internal dividing lines on

00:20:24.957 --> 00:20:26.957
who is responsible for what. I won't bore you with the

00:20:30.730 --> 00:20:32.730
details but you can understand certain entities like

00:20:34.900 --> 00:20:36.900
public works may be trash and right-of-way spread DPIE

00:20:39.605 --> 00:20:41.605
private properties, , eventeventDOE environmentally

00:20:42.241 --> 00:20:44.241
sensitive DOE. Once the trash contracts. So we also

00:20:46.946 --> 00:20:48.946
have the business development section that in a number

00:20:51.650 --> 00:20:53.650
of presentations and webinars. And how to videos on

00:20:56.355 --> 00:20:58.355
DPIE that we certainly hope to visit.

00:20:59.992 --> 00:21:02.827
Everything from how do I get a building permit to how
do I get my shot permitted. Do I even need a permit for

00:21:03.963 --> 00:21:05.296
my shed?
Most recently we launched the virtual third Thursday

00:21:08.567 --> 00:21:10.567
community meeting. This is a meeting held on Zoom or

00:21:13.873 --> 00:21:15.873
teams that anyone is invited to. And you can ask any

00:21:19.712 --> 00:21:21.712
question, it is an open forum meeting. We certainly

00:21:24.483 --> 00:21:26.483
hope as you have questions about construction,

00:21:28.220 --> 00:21:30.220
enforcement, inspections. That you attend this meeting.

00:21:31.924 --> 00:21:33.924
We met with DPIE as well as several other agencies in

00:21:37.763 --> 00:21:39.763
my cluster over the mayors of municipalities. In Prince

00:21:42.568 --> 00:21:44.568
George's County and we directed them to this as well.

00:21:47.873 --> 00:21:49.873
And understand this is popular with the community. We

00:21:52.745 --> 00:21:54.745
certainly hope you check it out. These are a list of

00:21:58.651 --> 00:22:00.651
all the DPIE publications defined in our website. The

00:22:03.489 --> 00:22:05.557
booklets available.
I really hope you take the time. DPIE staff has tried to make as much available online

00:22:07.159 --> 00:22:09.159
as possible. We know not everyone goes online but

00:22:09.461 --> 00:22:11.461
certainly it is the way everything is headed. We

00:22:11.764 --> 00:22:13.764
certainly hope you do and look for these publications.

00:22:14.990 --> 00:22:16.990
I would be remiss if I told you everything is

00:22:16.669 --> 00:22:18.669
wonderful, we know it is not. That is why many if you

00:22:19.772 --> 00:22:21.772
are here to voice concerns but we want to go through

00:22:22.608 --> 00:22:25.410
what are some of our current challenges?
Probably the number one challenge is staffing. And we

00:22:28.547 --> 00:22:30.547
are not alone in the staffing issue. If you look at

00:22:33.619 --> 00:22:35.619
every major government agency or government period in

00:22:37.323 --> 00:22:39.323
this area for Montgomery county to Fairfax to Arlington

00:22:41.493 --> 00:22:43.493
to others. We are going to struggle with attrition

00:22:45.631 --> 00:22:47.631
rates we have not seen in decades. As many of you know

00:22:51.170 --> 00:22:53.170
it is an employees market out there. Employees are able

00:22:55.774 --> 00:22:57.774
to move from job to job. They are able to negotiate

00:23:00.879 --> 00:23:02.879
salaries we have not seen in years largely driven by

00:23:05.484 --> 00:23:07.484
inflation and other issues. The county is not immune to

00:23:10.890 --> 00:23:11.556
that.
As you can imagine with a number of vacancies we have we are competing with the private sector for engineers as well. Certainly many of the private sector companies we

00:23:14.460 --> 00:23:16.460
partner with their having difficulty recruiting

00:23:17.396 --> 00:23:19.396
engineers. So once you start to lose those engineers we

00:23:22.301 --> 00:23:24.769
develop a backlog.
And as we try and make our way through the backlog we

00:23:29.410 --> 00:23:31.410
are training new employees as they come on. Certainly

00:23:32.978 --> 00:23:34.978
that is a large challenge not only for DPIE but other

00:23:37.816 --> 00:23:39.816
agencies and county government and other governments

00:23:40.919 --> 00:23:42.919
nationwide. The second challenge is timewise.

00:23:43.555 --> 00:23:45.555
Part of that is on the owners and applicants as well.

00:23:47.726 --> 00:23:49.726
We often find there are task s the owners and

00:23:51.530 --> 00:23:53.530
applicants need to do as matter. Conversely we don't

00:23:54.933 --> 00:23:56.933
have the staff to make personal phone calls to every

00:23:58.737 --> 00:24:00.737
applicant to ask why is it your project has not moved?

00:24:02.942 --> 00:24:04.942
Sometimes we firmly believe the applicant or owner just

00:24:06.378 --> 00:24:08.378
does not know what they next step is. Or what to do.

00:24:10.916 --> 00:24:12.916
That way their projects stalls and our electronic

00:24:15.654 --> 00:24:17.654
staffing system. That is something I think we can all

00:24:21.560 --> 00:24:23.560
do better. And ask applicants and customer service and

00:24:26.899 --> 00:24:28.899
DPIE. And the last challenge and certainly developing

00:24:31.603 --> 00:24:33.603
raw ground environmentally. Environmentally sensitive

00:24:34.573 --> 00:24:36.573
or building vertically. You may not understand the

00:24:39.311 --> 00:24:41.311
number of community agency partners that you have to

00:24:44.616 --> 00:24:46.616
coordinate with. And we list a number of those. To

00:24:50.522 --> 00:24:52.522
build anything in this county vertical building you

00:24:55.260 --> 00:24:57.260
have to coordinate BPRD SRPRD P&L possibly the Maryland

00:25:00.599 --> 00:25:02.599
Department of transportation if your frontage is on a

00:25:05.904 --> 00:25:07.904
state road. You may work with FEMA and get floodplain

00:25:11.810 --> 00:25:13.810
studies done. And Prince George's County soil

00:25:15.948 --> 00:25:17.948
conservation District may need to approve any dams or

00:25:21.286 --> 00:25:23.286
any kind of water entrapment devices that you are

00:25:26.592 --> 00:25:28.592
trying to build. Next slide.

00:25:29.561 --> 00:25:31.629
This again, some other challenges we are having with
site growth. As you can see we have a number of issues

00:25:32.300 --> 00:25:33.831
that are mostly all dealing with water.
As Prince George's County geographically is the ball

00:25:38.971 --> 00:25:40.971
for much of southern Maryland.

00:25:42.775 --> 00:25:44.775
When water drains it drains into Prince George's County

00:25:48.480 --> 00:25:50.480
from Anne Arundel to the County we get water running

00:25:54.820 --> 00:25:56.820
through the district. We are the low point for much of

00:26:01.760 --> 00:26:04.280
southern Maryland.
That is what you will see many of our issues are either

00:26:07.132 --> 00:26:09.132
water or sewer, storm drains. But I do want to talk

00:26:10.903 --> 00:26:12.903
about challenge number three. And this is been a

00:26:14.600 --> 00:26:16.600
challenge for a while. If you're developing a piece of

00:26:17.409 --> 00:26:19.409
property whether residential developer or commercial

00:26:19.445 --> 00:26:21.445
developer or industrial developer. If you have a master

00:26:22.514 --> 00:26:24.514
plan wrote that fronts your property. Our code says

00:26:25.584 --> 00:26:27.584
whether you are building a home or whether you are

00:26:29.210 --> 00:26:31.210
building MGM you have to drink the road up to standard.

00:26:32.758 --> 00:26:34.758
You have to to add your own cost and expense or pay fee

00:26:37.196 --> 00:26:39.196
and lieu yet to build to master plan standards. This is

00:26:40.966 --> 00:26:42.966
a stumbling block for many individuals trying to

00:26:43.702 --> 00:26:45.702
develop their own properties or homes.

00:26:45.737 --> 00:26:47.737
And certainly something that is probably deserving and

00:26:48.600 --> 00:26:50.600
it is deserving of additional discussion. And certainly

00:26:50.309 --> 00:26:52.309
we may want to think about is there a better way to do

00:26:54.120 --> 00:26:55.847
this in 2022.
This is a legacy code division that is back to the

00:26:59.184 --> 00:27:01.184
1970s and 80s. So we want to give you some sense of

00:27:03.889 --> 00:27:06.858
what is your department doing?
The inspections divisions these are the folks who go

00:27:11.830 --> 00:27:13.830
out on inspecting new construction.

00:27:15.167 --> 00:27:18.690
You can see for the fiscal years that the number of
inspections they have done.
In the number of employees who are doing those

00:27:22.374 --> 00:27:23.941
inspections.
Just reminder there are 260 work days in a calendar

00:27:28.247 --> 00:27:29.780
year.
So you wrap in holidays, vacations, sick leave you are

00:27:34.119 --> 00:27:36.119
down to 240 work days on average.

00:27:37.890 --> 00:27:39.890
If you divide some of these numbers by those employee

00:27:46.732 --> 00:27:48.732
numbers you will realize the average DPIE inspector is

00:27:54.673 --> 00:27:56.673
inspecting anywhere from 15 to 20 properties a day.

00:28:02.648 --> 00:28:04.648
So that is the kind of volume your county is doing. That means we have a lot of development. That is great News 4 us but that means we need everybody to be present and available when their inspection is scheduled. It also means if you miss your inspection for whatever

00:28:05.884 --> 00:28:07.884
reason you go back into the hopper.

00:28:08.153 --> 00:28:10.153
Again it is a 7-ten day delay.

00:28:12.958 --> 00:28:14.958
Looking at the enforcement division this is who is

00:28:18.730 --> 00:28:20.730
issuing citations for zoning violations.

00:28:21.934 --> 00:28:23.934
Code violations using the number of inspections they

00:28:23.969 --> 00:28:26.300
are doing as well.
There's are mostly complaint driven they need to go out

00:28:31.910 --> 00:28:33.910
and investigate and look.

00:28:34.646 --> 00:28:37.481
That is whether numbers are different than the inspections. The inspection knows exactly where they are going, in
the morning and what they are doing.

00:28:37.916 --> 00:28:39.916
Where's the enforcement division are out there they

00:28:43.555 --> 00:28:45.555
have to investigate these 40 and 24,000 and the last

00:28:50.596 --> 00:28:52.596
one the number you see.

00:28:54.132 --> 00:28:56.132
These are really just a number of you and those we

00:28:56.234 --> 00:28:58.369
issues that are simple name changes.
And/or business entities that are changing the way they

00:29:00.305 --> 00:29:01.973
do operations.
This does not include a use and occupancy permit tied

00:29:06.278 --> 00:29:08.312
to construction.
Meeting, if you will build your building or build out

00:29:10.716 --> 00:29:12.716
your building and get your use and occupancy permit as

00:29:14.860 --> 00:29:16.454
part of that process.
There is a whole set of numbers you deal with.

00:29:20.225 --> 00:29:22.225
Next slide.

00:29:25.263 --> 00:29:27.765
When I say we are struggling with employment wanted to
give you a sense of numbers again.
Because the engineers are a particular importance to

00:29:35.974 --> 00:29:38.109
us.
Many they are the ones who review your plans they keep

00:29:39.244 --> 00:29:41.244
things moving but we wanted to break it down. You can

00:29:41.346 --> 00:29:44.281
see FY 21 we hired 16 total employees and DPIE.
Three of which were engineers. As you can see we had more people leave DPIE in fiscal

00:29:48.120 --> 00:29:50.120
year 21 then we hired. Fiscal 22, the same. We hired 30

00:29:52.924 --> 00:29:54.924
employees, 11 total engineers but you can see we lost

00:29:56.962 --> 00:29:58.962
more employees again. We certainly hired more engineers

00:30:00.198 --> 00:30:02.198
that were separated fiscal year 22. Just to give you a

00:30:04.603 --> 00:30:06.603
sense of numbers DPIE has authorized complement is 308

00:30:08.240 --> 00:30:10.240
people. If you are losing roughly 20 or 30 people a

00:30:12.678 --> 00:30:14.678
year you are losing ten to 15 percent of your workforce

00:30:17.820 --> 00:30:19.820
on an annual basis. So what are the solutions in

00:30:21.119 --> 00:30:23.119
progress? What are we working on? We have instituted an

00:30:25.190 --> 00:30:27.190
occupational study for our engineers but this is not

00:30:28.794 --> 00:30:30.794
just DPIE engineers this is countywide. We want to see

00:30:32.831 --> 00:30:34.831
if we are competitive. Do we have engineers

00:30:36.680 --> 00:30:38.680
appropriately classified? What can we do help

00:30:38.870 --> 00:30:40.870
protection in pay? That is ongoing and we expect to see

00:30:43.308 --> 00:30:45.308
that study completed in June this year. We sought

00:30:46.912 --> 00:30:48.912
additional resources in the budget that was recently

00:30:50.148 --> 00:30:52.148
submitted to the County Council. Our budget is due by

00:30:54.152 --> 00:30:56.152
law to the County Council on March 15th. It was

00:30:58.190 --> 00:31:00.190
submitted and the County executive did her announcement

00:31:01.426 --> 00:31:03.426
last Wednesday. And that budget there are ten

00:31:04.629 --> 00:31:06.629
additional positions proposed for DPIE. Seven on the

00:31:07.866 --> 00:31:09.866
inspection side three on customer service. Why customer

00:31:11.690 --> 00:31:13.690
service? DPIE which is probably the most like a utility

00:31:15.107 --> 00:31:17.107
in county government does not have a dedicated customer

00:31:18.744 --> 00:31:20.744
service unit. That we expect our engineers who are

00:31:22.347 --> 00:31:24.347
reviewing plans to not only answer phone calls. But to

00:31:26.385 --> 00:31:28.385
answer emails. And it becomes that find balances all of

00:31:30.388 --> 00:31:32.388
you know. How do we thread the needle between making

00:31:34.426 --> 00:31:36.426
sure they are reviewing the plans but also being

00:31:38.630 --> 00:31:40.630
responsive and returning phone calls and emails? As you

00:31:41.666 --> 00:31:43.666
can imagine that is not an easy task. One of the things

00:31:46.505 --> 00:31:48.505
we are looking at and I want to give Lamont a lot of

00:31:51.743 --> 00:31:53.743
credit. This is one of the things you look at when he

00:31:56.581 --> 00:31:58.581
came on board. We certainly want ththank to the public

00:32:00.619 --> 00:32:02.619
information officer as well. We need to create a

00:32:04.222 --> 00:32:06.222
standalone customer service unit that can be responsive

00:32:07.459 --> 00:32:09.459
that can return phone calls, emails? Get people in the

00:32:11.463 --> 00:32:13.463
hopper. Certainly we all agree if we had infinite

00:32:15.100 --> 00:32:17.100
resources we would scale this up tomorrow. We would

00:32:18.703 --> 00:32:20.703
hire outside contractors to do all of this instantly.

00:32:22.340 --> 00:32:24.340
But that is not reality when living within county

00:32:25.977 --> 00:32:27.977
budgets and not fiscally responsible. Momentum, you

00:32:28.780 --> 00:32:30.780
will hear is little discussion among the engineering

00:32:32.500 --> 00:32:34.251
professionals about momentum.
That is the technology solution we are putting in place

00:32:37.880 --> 00:32:39.880
but that is the next generation technology solution to

00:32:40.525 --> 00:32:42.525
tie all of our legacy systems together.

00:32:43.228 --> 00:32:45.228
We are currently in the process of launching that. Like

00:32:48.333 --> 00:32:50.333
any large IT solution as you can imagine never goes off

00:32:53.939 --> 00:32:55.939
without a hitch. Certainly requires a lot of time and

00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:01.440
attention but we anticipate one, we will get better

00:33:03.648 --> 00:33:05.648
data on all of our systems communicate. Thus, the

00:33:08.253 --> 00:33:10.253
problem they like is a computer are not tied together

00:33:13.358 --> 00:33:15.358
as an enterprise whole.

00:33:15.393 --> 00:33:17.393
When we can do heat maps. When we can decide where resources are best utilized we

00:33:18.663 --> 00:33:20.663
think we are better able to manage the agency.

00:33:21.566 --> 00:33:23.566
The last thing we are working on an updated 3-1

00:33:28.840 --> 00:33:30.840
workflowow. Many constituents.

00:33:31.900 --> 00:33:33.900
He gave me an ear full just today on. And I promised

00:33:35.747 --> 00:33:37.747
him we will certainly look at this at his request. At

00:33:40.118 --> 00:33:42.118
the request of our citizens. When we roll 3-1-one came

00:33:44.890 --> 00:33:46.890
out three months ago designed to be a one-stop shop for

00:33:48.426 --> 00:33:50.426
citizen complaints. We no we could do better. Doing

00:33:51.997 --> 00:33:53.997
administrative closures. That is away to design

00:33:54.766 --> 00:33:56.766
citizens and residents. We are working on revised

00:33:57.936 --> 00:33:59.936
workflows. How we will communicate how that will look

00:34:01.506 --> 00:34:03.506
like. And I want to give Lamont and Sawont a lot of

00:34:06.278 --> 00:34:08.278
credit both of them flagged as an issue and something

00:34:10.215 --> 00:34:12.215
they said we needed to be doing better.

00:34:13.385 --> 00:34:15.385
And then the last piece I wanted and then we will wrap

00:34:17.956 --> 00:34:19.723
this up.
>> Mr. McCarthy?

00:34:21.826 --> 00:34:23.826
>> Yes.

00:34:24.229 --> 00:34:26.229
>> Given how.

00:34:26.464 --> 00:34:28.464
>> A very comprehensive presentation.

00:34:31.102 --> 00:34:33.102
Just tell them about 3-1-one.

00:34:33.672 --> 00:34:35.672
>> That they know about the land is.

00:34:36.942 --> 00:34:38.942
>> JARED McCARTHY: This is a community that the County

00:34:42.948 --> 00:34:45.749
launched as well.
The two chairs, community chairs designed to bring back

00:34:50.989 --> 00:34:52.989
recommended that will be public recommendations on how

00:34:56.561 --> 00:34:58.561
to do a better job at DPIE.

00:35:01.433 --> 00:35:03.433
How to streamline how to come up with better processes and solutions. And the rest of the slide is how you can contact us. Next slide. These are all the numbers you would need and these will

00:35:04.936 --> 00:35:06.936
be in the slide that is publicly available.

00:35:07.472 --> 00:35:09.472
These are the managers here on the auditorium with you

00:35:15.747 --> 00:35:18.582
today.
And would certainly love to hear from you. We are ready and willing to hear from you.
Thank you.

00:35:24.522 --> 00:35:26.522
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you Mr. McCarthy. A couple quick announcements, number one we don't set

00:35:28.960 --> 00:35:30.960
the heat in the building and it is hot.

00:35:33.398 --> 00:35:35.398
But able to get the doors open. We have over flow upstairs.

00:35:36.100 --> 00:35:38.100
Devin here can escort you upstairs for those of you who

00:35:39.537 --> 00:35:41.537
do not want to be standing or packed in as it will be

00:35:43.742 --> 00:35:45.742
cooler up there so you are not steamy.

00:35:46.311 --> 00:35:48.311
And we also put water I think on the press table in the

00:35:51.249 --> 00:35:52.650
back.
There is also one to the right down the wall.

00:35:55.954 --> 00:35:57.954
With that I no Mr. McCarthy wants to answer your

00:36:00.558 --> 00:36:02.558
questions I think if we take down questions since we

00:36:05.196 --> 00:36:07.196
have about 25 speakers signed up.

00:36:07.966 --> 00:36:09.966
That will take some time.

00:36:11.936 --> 00:36:14.171
If you have a question be sure you leave your
information.
Some of you left to emails some of you left illegible

00:36:20.412 --> 00:36:22.460
emails.
Make sure it's leaving a question the gentleman has

00:36:32.157 --> 00:36:34.157
your contact info.

00:36:35.860 --> 00:36:38.395
>> JARED McCARTHY: Mr. Chair if I make a request if anybody wants to send a card for follow-up they could put them on the corner here we are taking notes. And will do follow-up as well.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Great.

00:36:49.808 --> 00:36:51.808
>> DONNA J. BROWN, CLERK: Mr. Chair if I could just advise. For those 40 people or so who are not speaking tonight may go upstairs it is much cooler up there. Upstairs on the second floor.

00:36:54.279 --> 00:36:56.279
It is very warm.

00:36:57.348 --> 00:36:58.382
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR:
Good opportunity.

00:37:04.122 --> 00:37:06.122
Follow Devin. We will start with a sign up sheet you

00:37:08.126 --> 00:37:10.126
have the time or in front of me it is hard to miss. I

00:37:13.264 --> 00:37:15.264
will call to-three names at a time so come up toward

00:37:17.268 --> 00:37:19.268
the front so ready to go. When you hear your name come

00:37:21.639 --> 00:37:23.639
first after that get in line. We will start with Alice

00:37:25.643 --> 00:37:27.643
Bishop of Riverdale. Is Alice Bishop here?

00:37:28.213 --> 00:37:30.213
Not seeing a hand. Kathy Corly I know she is here.

00:37:46.231 --> 00:37:48.231
>> Thank you for having me this evening I want to start

00:37:53.304 --> 00:37:55.304
with I am a lifelong Saint George's County residents

00:37:58.643 --> 00:38:00.643
and I move back after marriage because I loved living

00:38:04.549 --> 00:38:06.549
in this county. After 22 years in my home in the powder

00:38:11.623 --> 00:38:13.623
Mills estate area. It is difficult living. We have

00:38:16.928 --> 00:38:18.928
multiple commercial businesses in our neighborhood that

00:38:21.650 --> 00:38:23.650
make it unsafe for us and our development. One is a

00:38:27.572 --> 00:38:29.572
vehicle transport company. We have been working on the

00:38:32.877 --> 00:38:34.877
County, the nuisance board. Recently zoning has come

00:38:37.582 --> 00:38:39.582
into play. We have been working on this nearly three

00:38:43.488 --> 00:38:45.488
years but the residents during this neighbors are

00:38:48.226 --> 00:38:50.226
working against it. Costing us thousandsthousands.

00:38:51.763 --> 00:38:53.763
Having to get attorneys to fight this in court so we

00:38:58.303 --> 00:39:00.303
are not made out to be racist. We have another business

00:39:04.776 --> 00:39:06.776
down the street that is roofing.

00:39:08.346 --> 00:39:10.346
And complain about trash. We have a school in our

00:39:15.453 --> 00:39:17.453
neighborhood. It is not safe for the kids to get back

00:39:23.294 --> 00:39:25.294
and forth from school. It is out of control. We have

00:39:31.169 --> 00:39:33.169
made a community group and even that is not helping.

00:39:38.276 --> 00:39:40.276
What I resent the most is working to have an better our

00:39:46.851 --> 00:39:48.851
community and it become on me that I am the problem.

00:39:54.692 --> 00:39:56.692
These communities in Prince Georges County are all

00:40:00.398 --> 00:40:02.398
suffering from the commercial businesses. It is

00:40:05.370 --> 00:40:07.104
terrible.
>> Next we have Jared Ardt followed by Tina Wilson and

00:40:17.949 --> 00:40:20.170
VerVersimmins.
>> Hi my name is Jaren Ardt my why Julie and I live in

00:40:28.660 --> 00:40:30.660
Glendale. I appreciate the opportunity to speak given

00:40:34.165 --> 00:40:36.165
our recent experience with DPIE.

00:40:37.602 --> 00:40:39.602
Since my why and I moved to Prince George's County 11

00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:44.400
years ago. A week and a half ago myself and six

00:40:46.477 --> 00:40:48.477
neighbors were between two days sided with 14,525

00:40:49.714 --> 00:40:52.316
dollarsil fines and fees.
My household received a correction notice and citation

00:40:53.885 --> 00:40:55.885
of fees totaling $1,165 due to alleged unpermitted

00:40:56.454 --> 00:40:58.454
improvements to my house. I want to clearly state I

00:40:59.691 --> 00:41:01.691
understand well DPIE does not make the rules but only

00:41:02.927 --> 00:41:04.927
enforces them. Will certainly not happy about being

00:41:05.496 --> 00:41:07.496
find I want to leave here remembering my concerns over

00:41:08.733 --> 00:41:10.733
how unprofessional my engagement was with DPIE. To

00:41:11.302 --> 00:41:13.302
start with the DPIE inspector lie to me regarding the

00:41:14.539 --> 00:41:16.539
nature of my citation. As indicated on my citation and

00:41:17.742 --> 00:41:19.742
as he told me on the phone the inspector that a

00:41:21.279 --> 00:41:23.279
complaint was filed one in fact no complaint was filed

00:41:24.515 --> 00:41:26.515
against my household. From what I have gathered only

00:41:27.385 --> 00:41:29.385
one or two of my seven neighbors have had complaints

00:41:30.621 --> 00:41:32.589
filed against them.
The problem is that the effective training for all

00:41:34.959 --> 00:41:36.959
complaint against is it is an entire neighborhood

00:41:37.962 --> 00:41:39.962
against each other. Next these budget divided no

00:41:40.932 --> 00:41:42.932
evidence on the alleged violations. Simply stuffed

00:41:43.568 --> 00:41:45.568
citations and my friend Georgia leaving a tax lien to

00:41:47.305 --> 00:41:49.305
the whims of the wind or rain or whether my family was

00:41:51.809 --> 00:41:53.809
gone for a week on vacation. Absent any evidence or

00:41:55.546 --> 00:41:57.546
explanation I spent several hours researching the code

00:41:58.549 --> 00:42:00.549
something that any professional inspector should have

00:42:01.185 --> 00:42:03.185
done before writing the citation. My research concludes

00:42:04.155 --> 00:42:06.155
I was in compliance with the code at the permitted

00:42:07.925 --> 00:42:09.925
requirements. A timeline the inspector did not verified

00:42:10.895 --> 00:42:12.895
before he wrote the citation. He cited my household by

00:42:14.665 --> 00:42:16.665
claiming I constructed a gazebo with patio pit a gazebo

00:42:18.403 --> 00:42:20.403
which is an open air structure with a thick solid roof

00:42:22.507 --> 00:42:24.507
but I do not have a gazebo the word pergola did not

00:42:27.110 --> 00:42:29.110
enter the code until 2022. Nearly a decade after it was

00:42:31.149 --> 00:42:33.149
constructed. A gazebo with patio has never been in the

00:42:34.886 --> 00:42:36.886
County code and the patio is under the square feet

00:42:38.623 --> 00:42:40.623
requirements for patio both now and then put forth the

00:42:42.360 --> 00:42:44.360
inspector chose to have a correction order and citation

00:42:45.730 --> 00:42:48.231
at the same time.
To seven different households that are all in

00:42:49.834 --> 00:42:51.834
compliance within 30 days but this implies the

00:42:52.403 --> 00:42:54.403
inspector could have used discretion and start with

00:42:55.600 --> 00:42:57.600
smaller correction order without assuming we are all

00:42:57.608 --> 00:42:59.608
dirtbags would not respond unless find more than $1,000

00:43:00.511 --> 00:43:02.511
all while knowing there's no way all these corrections

00:43:03.414 --> 00:43:05.414
could have been made in 30 days.

00:43:05.683 --> 00:43:07.683
All professional employee discretion this is the first

00:43:09.454 --> 00:43:11.454
one I have witnessed such unprofessional discussion by

00:43:13.224 --> 00:43:15.224
any law or code enforcement officer.

00:43:16.270 --> 00:43:18.270
Lastly I don't say this lightly but from what I have

00:43:24.735 --> 00:43:26.735
witnessed and heard recently to my perception that

00:43:31.750 --> 00:43:33.750
there was possible favoritism shown by the inspector

00:43:37.415 --> 00:43:39.415
toward one neighbor.

00:43:39.784 --> 00:43:41.952
Leading to potential retaliation by the inspector
against another neighbor. It appears these fines were

00:43:42.320 --> 00:43:44.688
peppered across the entire neighborhood to provide a
smokescreen which was targeted retaliation. I provide

00:43:44.856 --> 00:43:47.390
further details in a separate conversation if you like.
But at a minimum I would like DPIE banishment to look

00:43:48.259 --> 00:43:50.294
further into this. Where this leaves me no is without
that explanation.

00:43:50.294 --> 00:43:52.294
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: You've got to wrap up. Time.

00:43:55.566 --> 00:43:57.566
>> I will go ahead and lay my comments.

00:44:02.640 --> 00:44:03.673
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Okay. Tina Wilson followed by Michele Sims.
>> Good evening everyone my name is Tina Wilson and CEO

00:44:07.812 --> 00:44:09.812
of T 47 international located in Carrboro Maryland but

00:44:12.160 --> 00:44:14.160
I am here because I am new to occupancy of permitting

00:44:17.154 --> 00:44:19.154
process. Last Tuesday I was contacted by a federal

00:44:21.359 --> 00:44:23.359
agency to provide proof that I had an occupancy permit.

00:44:26.300 --> 00:44:28.300
I was unaware I was supposed to have an occupancy

00:44:30.701 --> 00:44:32.701
permit. Therefore I go to Prince Georges County website

00:44:34.906 --> 00:44:36.906
to find out what is the procedure. After two days of

00:44:40.440 --> 00:44:42.440
searching and not being successful I finally drove my

00:44:44.248 --> 00:44:46.248
tail appeared down the street to figure out how do I

00:44:49.387 --> 00:44:51.387
get one code to show that I am in this building renting

00:44:54.992 --> 00:44:56.992
500 ft. for an office and a lease there.

00:45:00.131 --> 00:45:02.131
They showed me how to do this but long story short took

00:45:04.869 --> 00:45:06.869
me another 20-25 minutes to get on the website to

00:45:08.806 --> 00:45:10.806
figure out after I saw a YouTube video. Finally got it

00:45:13.144 --> 00:45:15.144
working but then as of today I received an email

00:45:17.810 --> 00:45:19.810
stating that my permit could not be processed because I

00:45:21.520 --> 00:45:23.520
had the wrong owner. The original owner bought the

00:45:24.589 --> 00:45:26.589
building in 1982. And the combined print of that

00:45:28.125 --> 00:45:30.125
building before I even look forward to even look at to

00:45:32.463 --> 00:45:34.463
see if I get an occupancy permit.

00:45:35.232 --> 00:45:37.232
Now I recommend that with this monumental service

00:45:39.360 --> 00:45:41.360
you're doing maybe you could take a new business owners

00:45:43.774 --> 00:45:45.774
have never been through the process to walk through

00:45:48.450 --> 00:45:50.450
your process to see if it will work, number one.

00:45:52.783 --> 00:45:54.783
Two there could be possible recommendation that any new

00:45:56.220 --> 00:45:58.220
business that registers from Prince Georges County with

00:45:59.290 --> 00:46:01.290
the state of Maryland. That there is a link or

00:46:03.127 --> 00:46:05.127
something you are notified that this new business has

00:46:06.564 --> 00:46:08.564
been registered and that they need to get a use and

00:46:10.768 --> 00:46:12.768
occupancy permit with the countycounty. Without being

00:46:13.437 --> 00:46:15.437
fined $1,000 a day because you don't have the permit.

00:46:17.241 --> 00:46:19.900
Thank you.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you we have Michele Sue was followed by Timothy

00:46:21.812 --> 00:46:23.546
Kerr help.
>> Good afternoon several of you known me before I have

00:46:28.552 --> 00:46:30.552
spoken before this committee before.

00:46:31.288 --> 00:46:33.288
I feel abandoned by DPIE.

00:46:34.525 --> 00:46:36.525
I purchased my home two years ago and I am still

00:46:41.198 --> 00:46:43.198
fighting a real estate agent who sold my property and

00:46:47.238 --> 00:46:49.238
left me with thousands of dollars of renovations.

00:46:52.109 --> 00:46:54.109
I put the real estate commission.

00:46:55.346 --> 00:46:57.346
Through DPIE, DPIE promised things, they failed to do

00:46:59.830 --> 00:47:01.830
what they said they would do.

00:47:01.585 --> 00:47:03.585
I have hired lawyers.

00:47:04.822 --> 00:47:06.822
I do not understand how a real estate agent who is

00:47:09.960 --> 00:47:11.960
licensed in the state of Maryland can come in and do

00:47:15.132 --> 00:47:18.100
these kinds of things.
Not only did this happen to me it happened to other people. What is DPIE doing to work with the state to make sure.

00:47:21.272 --> 00:47:23.272
When these real estate investors are doing. You reach

00:47:24.475 --> 00:47:26.475
out to the state. Because us reaching to the state does

00:47:28.412 --> 00:47:30.412
nothing but now not only did this man turn around and

00:47:32.316 --> 00:47:34.316
sue me for what he did wrong. He let me owing him

00:47:36.587 --> 00:47:38.587
40,000 but left me with 60,000 and renovations.

00:47:39.423 --> 00:47:41.423
Something the math in here and it is happening all over

00:47:43.327 --> 00:47:45.327
the county. It feels like all these work signs and seen

00:47:47.264 --> 00:47:49.666
are not being addressed.
That is my concern.

00:47:55.940 --> 00:47:57.940
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you, Timothy Vafergale.

00:48:06.584 --> 00:48:08.584
>> For the last five years I have been the present the

00:48:10.254 --> 00:48:12.254
farmers market and every year that market is a permit

00:48:13.324 --> 00:48:14.958
from DPIE.
From a personal point of view every year and there are

00:48:17.862 --> 00:48:19.862
several of you on the Council know this.

00:48:20.731 --> 00:48:22.731
We have gotten a different demand from the reviewer's

00:48:24.168 --> 00:48:26.336
office at DPIE.
It is always different there are always things that

00:48:28.939 --> 00:48:30.939
could have been brought up before. And if there were

00:48:33.100 --> 00:48:35.100
that kind of inconsistency in my work product of my job

00:48:37.448 --> 00:48:39.448
I would not have that job very long. It is that

00:48:41.886 --> 00:48:43.886
simplesimple. And the real reason I am here causing me

00:48:45.923 --> 00:48:47.923
stress and dread when I have to go through that process

00:48:50.361 --> 00:48:52.361
is one thing. The reason I am here and this is

00:48:54.799 --> 00:48:56.799
something I have seen is a negative impact DPIE has on

00:48:59.236 --> 00:49:01.236
the economic development of our community. I have on

00:49:02.873 --> 00:49:04.873
many, many occasions is a market manager. I've had

00:49:06.510 --> 00:49:08.510
people express interest in becoming vendors. There

00:49:09.346 --> 00:49:11.346
little small businesses mom and pop operations we have

00:49:12.983 --> 00:49:14.784
heard about.
The vast majority of them I never see them again. The

00:49:17.688 --> 00:49:19.688
handle I have met again, they tell me they had a single

00:49:21.926 --> 00:49:23.926
interaction with DPIE and they either give up or went

00:49:25.496 --> 00:49:27.496
somewhere else. If we truly want to see our community

00:49:29.330 --> 00:49:31.330
prosper. And I certainly do that is what I have been

00:49:32.903 --> 00:49:34.903
doing this so long. The culture in that office needs to

00:49:36.841 --> 00:49:38.541
be addressed.
And - [APPLAUSE] I have interacted with many

00:49:44.114 --> 00:49:45.949
inspectors.
And they have always seemed like personally reasonable

00:49:48.285 --> 00:49:50.285
people who are focused and open to solutions.

00:49:51.655 --> 00:49:53.655
I have had meetings with the previous director and

00:49:56.961 --> 00:49:58.961
other senior management and again they have always

00:50:01.665 --> 00:50:03.665
seemed like competent people looking for solutions.

00:50:05.769 --> 00:50:07.769
And every time I had one of those meetings I thought

00:50:09.640 --> 00:50:11.640
great, this has been solved but it wasn't. The next

00:50:13.110 --> 00:50:15.110
time we applied for a permit a new demand was made and

00:50:17.281 --> 00:50:19.281
we were right back where we started from. Thank you for

00:50:21.118 --> 00:50:22.819
hearing me.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you. Next James followed by Janet Ingle.

00:50:24.889 --> 00:50:26.889
>> Thank you I live in Wiltshire Washington I am part

00:50:32.363 --> 00:50:34.363
of the noise disturbance working group.

00:50:36.433 --> 00:50:38.433
A group of residents and areas surrounding national

00:50:40.304 --> 00:50:42.304
harbor that organized in the fall 2021 to address the

00:50:45.142 --> 00:50:47.142
long-standing and persistent noise disturbances coming

00:50:48.450 --> 00:50:50.450
from national harbor events and operations. These

00:50:51.415 --> 00:50:53.415
violate the County Council's declaration, policy and

00:50:54.818 --> 00:50:56.818
noise ordinance section 19-120 protecting, quote, the

00:50:58.188 --> 00:51:00.188
use, enjoyment and protection of property with the

00:51:02.590 --> 00:51:04.590
intent to control noise levels. To promote the peace

00:51:06.397 --> 00:51:08.397
and quiet the inhabitants of the county. Now, since

00:51:10.768 --> 00:51:12.768
that time over a year and a half ago we engaged our

00:51:16.573 --> 00:51:18.573
district eight County councilmember. As will as top

00:51:20.444 --> 00:51:22.444
DPIE staff via emails and some meetings in an effort to

00:51:25.749 --> 00:51:28.685
answer three straightforward questions.
One, what are the applicable ordinances regarding noise

00:51:32.957 --> 00:51:34.957
disturbances from concerts, circuses, fireworks, tunnel

00:51:36.894 --> 00:51:38.894
noise from industrial level equipment, etcetera Second

00:51:41.498 --> 00:51:43.498
question, what if any consideration is given during the

00:51:47.438 --> 00:51:49.438
permitting process to excessive levels of noise from

00:51:52.710 --> 00:51:54.710
events that adversely impact well-established adjacent

00:51:56.647 --> 00:51:58.281
neighborhoods?
And third, what enforcement measures, fines and

00:52:05.723 --> 00:52:07.723
prohibitions against repeat offenses from violators

00:52:12.963 --> 00:52:15.164
exist.
That these noise disturbances affected large number of

00:52:17.434 --> 00:52:19.434
residents in different areas adjacent to or within

00:52:20.704 --> 00:52:22.704
national harbor is indicated by the many signatures on

00:52:24.408 --> 00:52:26.408
the petition calling for their end. As well as their

00:52:28.512 --> 00:52:31.147
coverage by local T.V.
news outlets. The apparent absence of cooperation or

00:52:34.218 --> 00:52:36.218
inherent lack of knowledge in identifying the process,

00:52:38.255 --> 00:52:40.255
chain of responsibility and basis for approving outside

00:52:42.326 --> 00:52:44.326
entertainment and festivals. We have been unable to

00:52:46.363 --> 00:52:48.363
obtain an answer to a simple question. Is there any

00:52:51.435 --> 00:52:53.435
enforceable limit to the noise disruptions being

00:52:54.972 --> 00:52:56.972
produced? And we have not gotten an answer.

00:52:59.430 --> 00:53:01.430
Does the permitting process take into any account the

00:53:03.480 --> 00:53:05.480
effect of noise disruption on residential communities?

00:53:06.917 --> 00:53:08.917
We have not identified any process by which DPIE or

00:53:11.822 --> 00:53:13.822
county agencies such as police would terminate noise

00:53:15.759 --> 00:53:17.759
disturbances as they are occurring. And many residents

00:53:19.730 --> 00:53:21.730
have reported noise disturbances to the police national

00:53:23.667 --> 00:53:25.667
harbor but no action is ever taken. So finally, as

00:53:28.572 --> 00:53:30.572
residents of Prince Georges County we expect greater

00:53:32.509 --> 00:53:34.509
transparency and cooperation from public officials. In

00:53:35.946 --> 00:53:37.946
addressing the harmful impact of unregulated noise

00:53:39.416 --> 00:53:41.416
disturbances upon residences. This may include changes

00:53:42.853 --> 00:53:44.853
to legislation, implementation and enforcement.

00:53:45.322 --> 00:53:47.322
Thank you. Sorry for going a little over. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you, Pat Myers and Carroll Jenkins.

00:54:08.612 --> 00:54:10.612
>> Good evening thank you for this opportunity for the

00:54:12.583 --> 00:54:14.583
people to tell you about their experiences with DPIE.

00:54:16.120 --> 00:54:18.120
It is important to hear from the people. I also want to

00:54:20.858 --> 00:54:22.858
remind you than it does you here this evening are only

00:54:25.195 --> 00:54:27.195
part of the information you need to make necessary

00:54:28.765 --> 00:54:30.933
improvements at DPIE.
You're not hearing from the people who aren't here. You need to hear from businesses of the contractors who work frequently with DPIE. Any need to hear from the DPIE staff about issues with staffing and barriers they face. And you need to have objective data about wait times and problems with adequate staffing. And difficulties with enforcement. Especially as we

00:54:33.437 --> 00:54:35.437
develop new regulations that decrease our collective

00:54:36.940 --> 00:54:38.940
impact on the environment and protect public health.

00:54:40.944 --> 00:54:42.944
There enforcement is a key element to make necessary

00:54:45.449 --> 00:54:47.449
change. In my capacity as chair of the Prince George's

00:54:50.454 --> 00:54:52.454
Sierra Club I often hear complaints about apparent

00:54:54.458 --> 00:54:56.458
failures to enforce regulations.

00:54:56.460 --> 00:54:58.460
Especially regarding runoff and construction sites.

00:54:59.263 --> 00:55:01.263
Like many people that find County processes and

00:55:03.000 --> 00:55:05.000
applications bewildering. When outcomes don't meet

00:55:05.803 --> 00:55:07.803
expectations it can be hard to know if the problem is

00:55:10.941 --> 00:55:12.941
with the contractor who was supposed to follow the

00:55:15.179 --> 00:55:17.179
rules, the County staff trying to enforce the rules of

00:55:19.850 --> 00:55:21.850
the rules them selves or maybe just their own

00:55:24.540 --> 00:55:25.988
unrealistic expectations.
Delays in the permitting process are legendary but we don't want shortcuts for special exemptions that make the rules meaningless. We need transparency, clarity and equity. It is very important for DPIE to have funds, the people

00:55:31.395 --> 00:55:33.395
and know how to enforce existing regulations and help

00:55:36.667 --> 00:55:39.402
people is standard.
It is important for the community to trust the county

00:55:41.839 --> 00:55:43.839
government will look out for County.

00:55:43.874 --> 00:55:45.874
Protect from unscrupulous contractors and safeguard the

00:55:48.345 --> 00:55:50.345
health and well-being by safe processes through code

00:55:53.417 --> 00:55:56.520
enforcement.
I do not want to pile on DPIE I want to build up. Given the resources it needs to do his job.
Thank you.

00:56:01.458 --> 00:56:04.327
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR:
Only clopping remember what I said at the beginning
only clapping for the chair.

00:56:04.394 --> 00:56:06.394
Thank you Greg.

00:56:06.663 --> 00:56:09.432
And Ms.
Gingle. Were displayed trying to give them the

00:56:11.868 --> 00:56:13.868
resources we want we are begging to give them the

00:56:16.173 --> 00:56:17.607
resources.
Ms. Myers? >> Good evening.

00:56:21.945 --> 00:56:23.945
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: It is two minutes. >> I know I just on that out. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: I know Ms. Myers.

00:56:25.182 --> 00:56:27.182
>> Were very good friends.

00:56:29.186 --> 00:56:31.186
I am Pat Myers from the Hillandale Garden Delphi area

00:56:37.227 --> 00:56:39.227
citizens Association put back for giving me this

00:56:43.634 --> 00:56:45.468
opportunity.
DPIE is the court of making Prince Georges communities

00:56:46.670 --> 00:56:48.670
livable and even inviting. It is a we/they should not

00:56:49.172 --> 00:56:51.172
be us and them. On page 18 of the 2021 also breaks

00:56:52.142 --> 00:56:54.377
administrative report highlights this is
quality-of-life supported by high performance of

00:56:54.878 --> 00:56:56.112
government.
I challenge that statement in the veracity of

00:56:58.782 --> 00:57:00.782
explanations that follow. Huge money losses have to be

00:57:02.886 --> 00:57:04.886
addressed we are paying one of the highest if not the

00:57:07.924 --> 00:57:09.924
highest taxes in DC and failing to use the tools

00:57:12.496 --> 00:57:14.496
available to the county. I am sure most of you are

00:57:17.501 --> 00:57:19.501
aware that DPIE had not reported permitted

00:57:20.704 --> 00:57:22.704
modifications to houses and building developments that

00:57:23.907 --> 00:57:25.907
the State Department of taxation to 2019.

00:57:27.110 --> 00:57:29.110
Amazing the County executive nor anyone else was aware

00:57:30.681 --> 00:57:32.681
this was going on. Why? Where is the accountability?

00:57:34.217 --> 00:57:36.217
Who was not watching the car? Point, 470 million is a

00:57:38.588 --> 00:57:40.588
lot to miss I would miss $5 if I lost it. Also this is

00:57:44.940 --> 00:57:46.940
still going on because many areas they are converting

00:57:47.664 --> 00:57:50.633
single-family homes to apartment dwellings.
And they are not being taxed.

00:58:01.545 --> 00:58:03.545
They are unlicensed contractors they are putting

00:58:03.580 --> 00:58:05.580
themselves and neighbors at risk. An easy way to do

00:58:06.550 --> 00:58:08.550
this is compare the multiple listings to the tax record

00:58:09.486 --> 00:58:11.486
and add what is needed and tax accordingly. And also

00:58:12.422 --> 00:58:14.422
have the inspectors visit the homes that are for sale

00:58:15.325 --> 00:58:17.325
on the market. And make them get a permit and wouldn't

00:58:18.562 --> 00:58:20.562
it be wonderful if Prince Georges was one of the areas

00:58:21.798 --> 00:58:23.798
in the DC area that promised a safe permitted home to a

00:58:25.302 --> 00:58:27.302
new buyer? As to the somebody having the experience

00:58:27.938 --> 00:58:29.938
that they have all these issues that were not revealed.

00:58:30.874 --> 00:58:32.475
Thank you.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you Ms. Myers. Carroll Jenkins followed by Bob

00:58:35.779 --> 00:58:37.279
Derek.
Followed by Adeline Cox.

00:58:47.124 --> 00:58:49.825
>> Thank you I am Carroll Jenkins representing West floral Civic Association and movers and shakers from district one. We are solution oriented.
And as a solution we would request visible permitting

00:58:59.669 --> 00:59:01.669
signage on residential construction site properties.

00:59:06.910 --> 00:59:08.910
This would help community members partner with DPIE to

00:59:10.547 --> 00:59:12.547
improve enforcement. Visible signs would help turn

00:59:13.383 --> 00:59:15.383
unpermitted construction into permitted construction.

00:59:15.419 --> 00:59:17.419
Which would be a big source of added revenue for Prince

00:59:19.856 --> 00:59:21.856
Georges County. Turning unpermitted construction into

00:59:22.292 --> 00:59:24.292
permitted construction would protect the health and

00:59:25.128 --> 00:59:27.128
safety of residents by preventing contractors from

00:59:27.964 --> 00:59:29.964
covering up dangerous electrical and structural

00:59:30.400 --> 00:59:32.400
defects. A visible sign of permitted construction would

00:59:33.637 --> 00:59:35.637
help all residents easily identify and make timely

00:59:36.873 --> 00:59:38.873
reports of construction sites where no permit is

00:59:40.110 --> 00:59:42.110
displayed. Currently only ethical contractors pay the

00:59:42.946 --> 00:59:44.946
county for the required permits.

00:59:44.981 --> 00:59:46.981
If community members new the visible signs of permitted

00:59:48.952 --> 00:59:50.952
constructions would be in the window all community

00:59:52.489 --> 00:59:54.489
members would have the assurance that a qualified

00:59:56.260 --> 00:59:58.260
County official will perform that inspection.

00:59:58.695 --> 01:00:00.695
If there is no visible sign a 3-1-1 reportrt can be

01:00:03.667 --> 01:00:05.667
quickly filed. Timely intervention is critical. And

01:00:06.837 --> 01:00:08.837
will have two positive effects. Safehouses and the

01:00:10.440 --> 01:00:12.440
spread of the word that Prince George's County enforces

01:00:14.544 --> 01:00:16.544
their codes. Right now an ethical contractors feel

01:00:18.148 --> 01:00:20.148
emboldened to skip permitting processes hired unskilled

01:00:21.318 --> 01:00:23.318
workers and there is a perception if there is any

01:00:25.822 --> 01:00:27.822
enforcement it will be after the contractor is gone.

01:00:29.893 --> 01:00:31.893
Leaving the unsuspecting homeowner to build the cost of

01:00:33.964 --> 01:00:35.964
remediation. Please help all community members become

01:00:37.133 --> 01:00:39.133
part of this process. Of making enforcement possible.

01:00:40.737 --> 01:00:42.737
Thank you.

01:00:45.509 --> 01:00:47.509
>> Thank you Robert Derek followed by Adeline Wilcox

01:00:51.147 --> 01:00:53.147
followed by Jean Kiggins.

01:00:53.650 --> 01:00:55.650
>> Good evening my name is Bob Derek I and the

01:00:57.654 --> 01:00:59.654
president of the Montr?al community community member of

01:01:00.557 --> 01:01:02.557
the 12 community theater group called movers and

01:01:03.460 --> 01:01:05.460
shakers. From across district one. I want to commend

01:01:06.730 --> 01:01:08.730
the Council for being brave enough to have a town hall

01:01:10.734 --> 01:01:12.734
on the Department of permitting, inspection and

01:01:13.303 --> 01:01:15.303
enforcement. My comments are commented at the 3-1-one

01:01:16.206 --> 01:01:18.206
ticket system and those inspectors and enforcement. Let

01:01:19.109 --> 01:01:21.109
me start by saying the DPIE enforcement division has

01:01:22.412 --> 01:01:24.412
one of the county's most challenging public facing

01:01:25.315 --> 01:01:27.315
missions. They have to be part social worker, parts

01:01:28.585 --> 01:01:30.585
lawyer, part engineer, part lawyer and part law

01:01:31.488 --> 01:01:33.488
enforcement officer. But it must be done as a single a

01:01:35.492 --> 01:01:37.492
rule not enforced ceases to be a rule. We have been

01:01:39.496 --> 01:01:41.496
working the last couple of years with the leadership

01:01:42.799 --> 01:01:44.533
from DPIE.
And we have been told some crazy answers to our answers

01:01:47.137 --> 01:01:49.137
about the 3-1-one ticket system. The new one that was

01:01:50.407 --> 01:01:52.407
just rolled out and that all of the legacy tickets were

01:01:54.100 --> 01:01:56.100
tossed out on the new system was put on line.

01:01:57.280 --> 01:01:59.280
It is hard to believe a performance requirement could

01:02:01.418 --> 01:02:03.418
not have been required for the new system to accept old

01:02:06.489 --> 01:02:08.489
ticketstickets. We are also continually been told the

01:02:10.160 --> 01:02:12.160
system is still being debugged new modules are being

01:02:14.297 --> 01:02:16.665
rolled out everyday.
Am I to understand the basic user acceptance testing

01:02:19.436 --> 01:02:21.436
was not done before switching over to a new system?

01:02:23.607 --> 01:02:25.607
Will we would like to see is appropriate metrics.

01:02:36.353 --> 01:02:38.353
And we have committed to working with the county to come up with those metrics. We believe the best metric is the customer block at the

01:02:39.356 --> 01:02:40.656
end.
Was your problem solved or not solved?

01:02:42.250 --> 01:02:44.250
There could be a caveat for that wasn't moved to the

01:02:45.762 --> 01:02:47.762
next step because not all issues that go to DPIE

01:02:49.165 --> 01:02:51.165
enforcement are there issue. But there should not be a

01:02:52.602 --> 01:02:54.602
block that says close because I went to another agency

01:02:56.600 --> 01:02:58.700
or another department.
Thank you.

01:03:01.811 --> 01:03:03.811
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you. Ms. Wilcox, Jean and then Theresa Waters.

01:03:08.685 --> 01:03:10.685
>> I have lived in my home in unincorporated 28 years.

01:03:12.989 --> 01:03:14.989
Nine years ago Michele Obama was growing milkweed at

01:03:19.763 --> 01:03:21.763
the White House to help the now endangered Monarch

01:03:26.503 --> 01:03:28.270
butterfly.
For the last few years I have enabled Monarch butterfly

01:03:29.806 --> 01:03:32.410
reproduction in my front yard.
To do this I allowed milkweed to grow. I put up a

01:03:36.112 --> 01:03:38.112
Spanish-language sign explaining what I was doing. But

01:03:39.516 --> 01:03:41.516
DPIE cited me for weeds and tall grass.

01:03:42.886 --> 01:03:44.886
Because of the scorched earth policy I cannot follow

01:03:49.993 --> 01:03:51.993
USDA, US EPA and Maryland guidance.

01:03:54.731 --> 01:03:56.731
I recommend PG County replace the insane DPIE insane

01:04:01.471 --> 01:04:03.471
process with chatGPT I filed in court this afternoon.

01:04:08.178 --> 01:04:10.112
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you Ms. Wilcox.
Gene Cachins, Theresa Waters.

01:04:15.385 --> 01:04:17.385
And then >> I am a resident of West floral the last 23

01:04:48.118 --> 01:04:50.118
years.

01:05:22.952 --> 01:05:25.888
l the last 23 years.
I will speak very briefly on both of those. When businesses operating in a residential neighborhood

01:05:28.691 --> 01:05:30.691
that is a zoning issue as I have learnedlearned. But it

01:05:34.731 --> 01:05:36.731
does not seem working together seems like it can

01:05:39.636 --> 01:05:41.636
sometimes be a negative feedback loop. Where one

01:05:44.700 --> 01:05:46.700
department indicates we have already sent an inspector

01:05:48.411 --> 01:05:50.411
and found nothing. And so they don't look into it

01:05:53.850 --> 01:05:55.850
because another department already has. And it is a

01:05:58.788 --> 01:06:00.788
shame when even photographic evidence of large

01:06:02.625 --> 01:06:04.625
industrial equipment like a paint booth that is used to

01:06:08.970 --> 01:06:10.970
refinish auto parts. Chrome buffers, just to spruce up

01:06:13.200 --> 01:06:15.200
the way vehicles look. A pink booth operating in a

01:06:18.475 --> 01:06:20.475
residential neighborhood. A paint booth that was large

01:06:22.846 --> 01:06:24.846
enough it needed a forklift in order to placed into a

01:06:28.885 --> 01:06:30.885
shed. And then the sandblasting noise you get as you

01:06:34.357 --> 01:06:36.357
remove rust or any other things that are on the device

01:06:40.396 --> 01:06:42.396
that is going to be painted.

01:06:43.666 --> 01:06:45.666
This is operating in a residential neighborhood. And

01:06:48.972 --> 01:06:50.972
when you put in a complaint regarding air quality. It

01:06:55.612 --> 01:06:57.612
limits you because it indicates toxic fumes or fumes.

01:07:01.584 --> 01:07:03.584
And once you click on that because it is the closest

01:07:03.920 --> 01:07:06.222
thing to your violation description of the inspector
focuses on that.

01:07:06.222 --> 01:07:08.222
So the report when it is closed out is no odor is

01:07:11.327 --> 01:07:12.728
found.
On my complaint was not orders or fumes it is a paint

01:07:16.499 --> 01:07:17.900
booth.
And when you have a full-page picture of the

01:07:21.437 --> 01:07:23.437
installation these are large things.

01:07:23.973 --> 01:07:25.973
And it takes a forklift.

01:07:28.770 --> 01:07:30.770
Okay this is not a small piece of equipment.

01:07:34.784 --> 01:07:36.784
And there is no follow-up so this continues to exist.

01:07:37.687 --> 01:07:39.388
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.
>> I have run out of time the second is the rental

01:07:45.695 --> 01:07:47.296
licensing.
That is impossible to enforce. There is a huge loophole with the familiar

01:07:48.765 --> 01:07:50.650
relationship.
Any air BNB or rent by the room tenant is a cousin of

01:07:57.473 --> 01:07:59.473
the homeowner who hasn't lived there 30 years.

01:08:02.645 --> 01:08:04.645
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr.

01:08:06.683 --> 01:08:08.683
>> I sympathize with the enforcement on issues like

01:08:10.987 --> 01:08:12.454
that.
>> SPEAKER: It is not enforceable what can they do.

01:08:18.528 --> 01:08:20.195
Solutions have to be found for these things. And going back on my complaint will briefly.
One thing I suggest is when the inspector goes out to

01:08:25.268 --> 01:08:27.268
inspect a complaint they visit the complaint and.

01:08:29.672 --> 01:08:31.672
They will be out there anyway visit the complainant you

01:08:34.210 --> 01:08:36.210
will be surprised how much you will hear if you listen

01:08:39.215 --> 01:08:41.215
or how much you will see if you look.

01:08:43.286 --> 01:08:45.286
And the complaint and is in the best position to guide the inspector. C, you could not see it when you walk to the front.

01:08:46.756 --> 01:08:48.756
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr.

01:08:56.320 --> 01:08:58.233
I know you very well. I will just say this. We know about the cousins, the cousins are a real
problem.
Mr. McCarthy I saw his sandblasting situation and I

01:09:02.171 --> 01:09:04.171
believe DPIE said there was no problem.

01:09:06.900 --> 01:09:08.900
That was a joke. Thank you Mr Gachins.

01:09:09.946 --> 01:09:12.681
. [APPLAUSE].
>> SPEAKER: Hi, thank you so much for counsel for

01:09:19.389 --> 01:09:21.389
allowing us to speak my name is Theresa Waters.

01:09:26.329 --> 01:09:28.329
We live at 6711 Former Drive in Fort Washington in district eight. And the reason why we are here is because we have a

01:09:32.969 --> 01:09:34.969
permit submitted by plans to DPIE in 2022 permit number

01:09:38.508 --> 01:09:40.508
55974 - 2022 - 0.

01:09:41.244 --> 01:09:43.244
To date we are still sitting somewhere in DPIE.

01:09:46.783 --> 01:09:48.783
Don't really have an idea as to where we are in the

01:09:52.522 --> 01:09:54.522
process because the website does not allow us to go on

01:09:57.760 --> 01:09:59.760
and see what stages have been checked off and which

01:10:02.532 --> 01:10:04.966
stages are missing.
>> Thank you for having us another reason we are here

01:10:07.170 --> 01:10:09.170
it has been a long time in the planning.

01:10:09.806 --> 01:10:11.806
And which is simply increase the service of our

01:10:15.311 --> 01:10:17.512
childcare center.
When we started planning back into 2020-21.

01:10:20.316 --> 01:10:22.316
You know, it is construction that we are looking to do.

01:10:26.556 --> 01:10:28.556
And costing back in 2021 I know DPIE is not responsible

01:10:33.362 --> 01:10:35.597
for inflation.
But the time that is gone on from 2021 to cost 2022 and

01:10:40.360 --> 01:10:42.360
now 2023 probably built into 2024.

01:10:42.538 --> 01:10:44.538
Thousands and thousands of dollars we will have to come

01:10:48.544 --> 01:10:50.544
up with in addition to that.

01:10:52.148 --> 01:10:54.148
The community ever since childcare landscape.

01:11:01.824 --> 01:11:03.658
And running out of time.
So we need to one of the individuals who need some

01:11:07.897 --> 01:11:09.364
guidance.
Quick the issue is we had a special for childcare that

01:11:12.502 --> 01:11:14.502
included the house on the property.

01:11:14.737 --> 01:11:16.737
We also have a barn that is on the property that is

01:11:23.112 --> 01:11:25.112
ever been in the special.

01:11:26.582 --> 01:11:28.785
All we are trying to do is expand the barn to increase
the footprint where we are to continue to do the
business we are doing.

01:11:28.785 --> 01:11:30.785
However, I do believe we will have to go back yet again

01:11:34.190 --> 01:11:36.190
for another special exception to do something that has

01:11:38.227 --> 01:11:40.227
nothing to do with our original building. And again we

01:11:42.698 --> 01:11:44.698
need guidance, a contact person. Where we are the stage

01:11:47.203 --> 01:11:49.203
of the game. One of the things we need to do on our end

01:11:53.476 --> 01:11:55.476
to move things forward. And I no I spoke to one of the

01:11:59.315 --> 01:12:01.315
slides challenge number two. Because we are in

01:12:02.919 --> 01:12:04.386
purgatory.
>> We are here because we don't know what we don't know

01:12:06.189 --> 01:12:08.189
so we hope we can find out and make sure all of our T's

01:12:09.492 --> 01:12:11.426
are crossed and I's.
>> And have DPIE help us move forward.

01:12:15.765 --> 01:12:17.765
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: A couple of things the

01:12:18.134 --> 01:12:20.134
best thing to know is what you don't know so working

01:12:20.803 --> 01:12:22.803
that direction. And if you have zoning issues you

01:12:22.939 --> 01:12:25.874
probably want to talk with parks and planning.
>> SPEAKER: We finally have a application meeting with

01:12:28.477 --> 01:12:30.477
parks and planning this coming Friday.

01:12:30.913 --> 01:12:32.913
But our changes are very minor.

01:12:32.915 --> 01:12:34.915
Nothing that we are asking to expand on could

01:12:43.626 --> 01:12:45.626
incorporate the existing house for the special

01:12:51.934 --> 01:12:53.934
exemption is.

01:12:54.337 --> 01:12:56.337
>> JARED McCARTHY: It is probably more obligated than

01:12:56.973 --> 01:12:58.973
that when you have a special exemption handled by parks

01:12:59.875 --> 01:13:01.875
and planning there are a lot of requirements with that.

01:13:02.845 --> 01:13:04.845
Why don't you either give us a card we will give you a

01:13:06.649 --> 01:13:08.649
card. And we will follow up with you.

01:13:08.985 --> 01:13:10.985
>> SPEAKER: Thank you. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you next we have Franklin Jackson, followed by

01:13:12.154 --> 01:13:14.154
Theresa Brown. And then into the handwritten ones I

01:13:15.291 --> 01:13:16.992
can't read.
>> Thank you Mr. Chairman.

01:13:19.996 --> 01:13:21.996
I would like to thank you all of my fellow citizens in

01:13:24.600 --> 01:13:26.600
Prince George coming out. Because it shows just how

01:13:28.700 --> 01:13:30.700
concerned and committed people are. DPIE is an

01:13:31.107 --> 01:13:33.107
organization that has a tremendous amount of impact on

01:13:34.577 --> 01:13:36.577
the daily lives and quality of life of people in Prince

01:13:38.781 --> 01:13:40.781
George's County. And there are some needs there. And we

01:13:42.618 --> 01:13:44.618
hope DPIE gets to operate more efficiently than it does

01:13:46.455 --> 01:13:47.822
now.
And we appreciate the Council taking the bull by the

01:13:51.894 --> 01:13:53.894
horns in regards to this matter. I've been working on

01:13:56.966 --> 01:13:58.966
this matter two years is a personal matter that has to

01:14:02.571 --> 01:14:04.571
do with my yard. We built our house 21 years ago. And

01:14:08.644 --> 01:14:10.644
when we built the house our County made us put a

01:14:14.250 --> 01:14:16.250
drainage pipe on our driveway about 50 feet up.

01:14:18.821 --> 01:14:20.821
It was a natural drain field going across our front yard. Then they told us we could leave the swell there or

01:14:22.992 --> 01:14:24.992
pipe the entire front yard and cover the swell. So we

01:14:27.196 --> 01:14:29.196
decided to leave this will put the pipe in our

01:14:31.000 --> 01:14:33.000
driveway. And the drain goes to a wooded area. And it

01:14:35.171 --> 01:14:37.171
goes to our neighbors yard. And my neighbor decided it

01:14:38.974 --> 01:14:40.974
is the second neighbor. Was it the third neighbor?

01:14:42.411 --> 01:14:44.411
Decided he wanted to put decorative stones on this

01:14:46.382 --> 01:14:48.382
drain pad. Inevitably when you put these big stones in

01:14:50.753 --> 01:14:52.753
the drain pad started blocking and so no there is

01:14:55.157 --> 01:14:57.157
erosion in my yard where I had the drain pipe in the

01:15:00.429 --> 01:15:02.429
front yard. There is erosion in my backyard with the

01:15:04.834 --> 01:15:06.834
drain field runs into that drain field. There are other

01:15:09.271 --> 01:15:11.271
problems in terms of trees no dying and falling down. I

01:15:14.110 --> 01:15:16.110
started calling DPIE two years ago in February 2021.

01:15:18.470 --> 01:15:20.470
And DPIE came out they look at it in said there's a

01:15:23.352 --> 01:15:25.352
problem there. I will have to report to my supervisor.

01:15:27.723 --> 01:15:29.723
He reported to his supervisor the supervisor called me.

01:15:31.694 --> 01:15:33.694
And he stopped calling. At one point they told me the

01:15:36.532 --> 01:15:38.532
easement that was recorded on our plot they could not

01:15:40.936 --> 01:15:42.936
find it. Indicating they may have never actually

01:15:44.440 --> 01:15:46.440
recorded the easement. Although we gave them the

01:15:47.943 --> 01:15:49.943
easement when we built our house. So it is just

01:15:52.348 --> 01:15:54.348
frustrating dealing with DPIE. I have called them many

01:15:56.318 --> 01:15:58.318
times over the last two years to fix this problem. The

01:16:01.157 --> 01:16:03.157
inspector will come out and he will acknowledge there

01:16:05.940 --> 01:16:07.940
is a problem and it is caused by the boaters but in the

01:16:10.833 --> 01:16:12.833
drain pad but they have not done anything about it.

01:16:15.204 --> 01:16:17.204
I just don't know why DPIE when it do something about a

01:16:20.843 --> 01:16:22.843
problem that only they really could handle. Thank you.

01:16:25.470 --> 01:16:27.470
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you. Mr. Jackson I am sure DPIE will be back in

01:16:30.319 --> 01:16:32.319
touch with you. This is Therese Brown followed by Joyce

01:16:34.723 --> 01:16:36.723
Thorpe followed by Patricia Munroe.

01:16:36.926 --> 01:16:38.926
>> SPEAKER: Good evening I am Therese Brown I am a

01:16:40.996 --> 01:16:42.996
longtime resident of Prince Georges County. And I am

01:16:44.300 --> 01:16:46.300
here to speak on behalf of what we call Newton Village

01:16:48.337 --> 01:16:50.337
but we live just outside the town limits of Legion

01:16:52.410 --> 01:16:54.410
prepared we live outside the city but the benefit from

01:16:55.711 --> 01:16:57.711
the city but we have run into several issues we applied

01:16:59.748 --> 01:17:01.748
in the community a house that burned down. When the

01:17:03.419 --> 01:17:05.419
house burned down a business moved in and took over

01:17:07.122 --> 01:17:09.122
property. They disturb the peace of the home that was

01:17:10.793 --> 01:17:12.793
right behind that vacant lot. They were there for

01:17:14.960 --> 01:17:16.960
approximately 2.5 years it took DPIE to remove them.

01:17:17.433 --> 01:17:19.433
Nobody knows who the property belongs to. We're still

01:17:20.769 --> 01:17:22.769
trying to finish figure that out but in the meantime it

01:17:24.807 --> 01:17:26.807
is used as a dump it come up with suggestions not just

01:17:29.211 --> 01:17:30.578
complaints.
DPIE came through they did the rezoning but what we

01:17:32.715 --> 01:17:34.715
live our two residential plaques surrounded by

01:17:34.917 --> 01:17:36.917
construction businesses but all kinds of other

01:17:37.860 --> 01:17:39.860
businesses. They use our streets to park on the use our

01:17:40.523 --> 01:17:42.523
streets to dump it the chicken plant at the top of the

01:17:44.293 --> 01:17:46.293
street dump their water into our pond the middle of our

01:17:47.730 --> 01:17:49.730
street. Our street smells like dead people.

01:17:49.899 --> 01:17:51.899
We still are sitting here four years later waiting for

01:17:53.469 --> 01:17:55.469
them to decide what they will do to fix it. Than

01:17:57.406 --> 01:17:59.406
talking about soul carpet with people park their car on

01:18:00.976 --> 01:18:02.976
the side of the road and link them for sale days and

01:18:05.281 --> 01:18:07.281
weeks but they do that because there is no enforcement.

01:18:08.851 --> 01:18:10.851
We decided to do is help you get revenue that comes off

01:18:13.122 --> 01:18:15.122
of the back of taxpayers paid once you enforce the code

01:18:17.590 --> 01:18:19.590
you get revenue. Multiple uses of the stationary

01:18:19.895 --> 01:18:21.895
cameras you use to take pictures of cameras at speed.

01:18:23.465 --> 01:18:25.465
That is revenue you can take those blighted properties

01:18:26.702 --> 01:18:28.702
and rehab them sooner so they will be producing rental

01:18:30.272 --> 01:18:33.410
property income or owner income.
That is revenue for the county.

01:18:38.147 --> 01:18:40.147
These are ideas that could come about and keep

01:18:46.889 --> 01:18:48.889
taxpayers from having taxes raised.

01:18:51.727 --> 01:18:53.727
>> SPEAKER: Good evening my name is Joyce Thorpe I live

01:18:55.798 --> 01:18:57.798
on Asher Road about 100 yards from national harbor.

01:18:59.134 --> 01:19:01.134
One of my colleague spoke about noise at the harbor.

01:19:04.506 --> 01:19:06.506
I'm asking all my comments entered into the record but

01:19:09.878 --> 01:19:11.878
I do want to start by thanking Congressman - me Edward

01:19:15.784 --> 01:19:17.784
Burroughs because he at least got DPIE to give us a

01:19:21.657 --> 01:19:23.224
nonresponse.
And he worked hard to get that done. Anyone here who

01:19:27.663 --> 01:19:29.663
knows me how many years I worked at the United States

01:19:33.680 --> 01:19:35.680
Congress. If DPIE does not start enforcing the noise

01:19:37.506 --> 01:19:39.506
ordinance against national harbor, I am going to have

01:19:41.910 --> 01:19:43.910
the United States Department of Justice investigate why

01:19:45.848 --> 01:19:47.848
there is a different enforcement for national harbor

01:19:49.785 --> 01:19:51.785
and the residents of Prince Georges County. And

01:19:53.722 --> 01:19:55.722
everyone here who knows me knows that I am capable of

01:19:59.128 --> 01:20:01.129
that. Okay?
Don't you know me will I do it?

01:20:04.566 --> 01:20:06.566
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Joyce I know you and I know you will do it but focus

01:20:07.269 --> 01:20:08.503
here.
>> Midnight I am asleep. I hear 50 jet engines take

01:20:12.341 --> 01:20:14.341
off. And it goes on 24 hours. It is the air handlers

01:20:17.646 --> 01:20:19.646
and they say it is a once or twice a year think that

01:20:23.385 --> 01:20:25.385
they must do. But when I finally go to sleep I am

01:20:28.691 --> 01:20:30.691
awakened at 8 a.m the next morning loud music and noise

01:20:33.562 --> 01:20:35.562
off and on for hours but guess what that is? A sound

01:20:38.867 --> 01:20:40.867
check for a concert that will jump off at noon. I go

01:20:44.173 --> 01:20:46.173
over there, there are speakers 12 feet high facing our

01:20:48.577 --> 01:20:50.577
homes. That another noise comes in it is the universal

01:20:53.150 --> 01:20:55.150
soul circus at Southpoint with the speakers 12 feet

01:20:56.985 --> 01:20:58.985
high banks of five and ten of them facing my home. My

01:21:02.291 --> 01:21:05.590
neighbors windows are rattling.
So I just want to know. I am gone. Why DPIE cannot

01:21:07.896 --> 01:21:09.896
enforce the noise ordinance against national harbor.

01:21:10.132 --> 01:21:11.766
Thank you.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr.

01:21:15.571 --> 01:21:16.604
McCarthy inquiring minds want to know paid.
>> JARED McCARTHY: I am sorry, chair.

01:21:27.116 --> 01:21:29.116
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Inquiring minds want to know paid. >> JARED McCARTHY: That is zoned as special

01:21:30.652 --> 01:21:32.652
entertainment district by the County Council bid and

01:21:34.223 --> 01:21:36.223
all of those are permitted uses. So if you want to talk

01:21:39.495 --> 01:21:41.495
about the noise ordinance rule we will have to go a

01:21:44.366 --> 01:21:46.366
little more in depth conversation.

01:21:46.568 --> 01:21:48.568
>> You cannot give someone a permit to break the law

01:21:50.506 --> 01:21:52.506
continuously. Because I still haven't spoken about the

01:21:53.409 --> 01:21:55.409
fireworks every night weeks on end. Don't tell me about

01:21:56.979 --> 01:21:58.979
a special event or a special permit. Exceptions and

01:22:00.215 --> 01:22:02.215
exemptions. If this is so maybe we need to change the

01:22:04.153 --> 01:22:06.153
laws to protect the residents and not just the

01:22:07.389 --> 01:22:10.324
businesses.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Thorpe as I recall I have been your lawyer before I
will look into this for you. Just make I will look into

01:22:10.993 --> 01:22:12.727
it in talk to Mr.
McCarthy but we need to move on.

01:22:14.997 --> 01:22:16.997
Patricia Munroe followed by it looks like Veronica

01:22:21.370 --> 01:22:23.370
steals. Go ahead.

01:22:23.739 --> 01:22:25.739
>> Good evening my name is Patricia Munroe I'm

01:22:27.743 --> 01:22:29.743
president of the South lawn citizens Association. My

01:22:31.313 --> 01:22:33.313
concern is there is no communication between DPIE and

01:22:35.317 --> 01:22:37.317
the other agencies but I will give you a prime example.

01:22:40.222 --> 01:22:42.222
I have an illegal pawnshop of try to shut down since

01:22:45.127 --> 01:22:47.127
2018. It is at 7001 S. Lawn. The other day I noticed a

01:22:50.899 --> 01:22:52.899
truck pulling up to pour concrete so I immediately went

01:22:55.370 --> 01:22:57.370
in and checked the permit status. There are two permits

01:22:59.808 --> 01:23:01.808
pending 40855, 2022, and 478417478417-2022. Both of

01:23:02.945 --> 01:23:04.945
these permits have been granted to this individual

01:23:06.515 --> 01:23:08.515
knowingly that we have been trying to shut him down for

01:23:11.386 --> 01:23:13.386
running an illegal car business since 2018. It does not

01:23:15.858 --> 01:23:17.858
make sense. Somebody please help me understand how can

01:23:19.862 --> 01:23:21.862
you issue permits to somebody. The other part of it he

01:23:24.766 --> 01:23:26.766
already started building the shed, garage, two more.

01:23:28.337 --> 01:23:30.337
And on top of that he poured concrete in the permit has

01:23:32.808 --> 01:23:34.808
not been approved. Yes. He has been running his

01:23:36.178 --> 01:23:38.178
business forever and we have a lot of that going on in

01:23:40.682 --> 01:23:42.682
this county. I don't understand why, but it is

01:23:44.520 --> 01:23:46.520
ridiculous and the bad part is a lot of these places

01:23:48.156 --> 01:23:50.156
are operating on the weekend. You all don't have staff

01:23:51.894 --> 01:23:53.894
available on the weekends. You don't have staff you can

01:23:55.631 --> 01:23:57.631
call on an emergency basis and say can you shut this

01:23:59.735 --> 01:24:01.735
down. Have you all ever asked, and maybe some people

01:24:03.472 --> 01:24:05.472
would be willing to volunteer to help you out. You are

01:24:07.576 --> 01:24:10.444
laughing but I am serious.
There may be people willing to volunteer to help you get some of this cleared off the books. Mr. McCarthy I would love the idea he said everything)

01:24:12.648 --> 01:24:14.648
everything I see in the system that applies to you

01:24:15.884 --> 01:24:17.884
putting in the new system has dropped out of the

01:24:19.870 --> 01:24:21.870
system. I am having to go back pull it all up again,

01:24:22.925 --> 01:24:24.925
put it on a spreadsheet. And I asked DPIE if I sent it

01:24:27.129 --> 01:24:29.129
to them. And they did not say if I put it on a

01:24:31.300 --> 01:24:33.300
spreadsheet and you start addressing it. We have

01:24:33.869 --> 01:24:35.869
literal holes in the back wall. When I say hold I am

01:24:37.706 --> 01:24:39.706
afraid someone will step down in the hole and he will

01:24:41.243 --> 01:24:44.178
pay the cost? You all are.
I am done.

01:24:49.518 --> 01:24:51.518
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you next Veronica Steel followed by Jon Robinson

01:24:55.457 --> 01:24:58.426
and JoJoan Day.
>> Good evening my name is Veronica Desteel and I am

01:25:02.197 --> 01:25:04.197
here thank you for the opportunity to share my personal

01:25:06.501 --> 01:25:08.501
experience living with an invisible disability and

01:25:09.538 --> 01:25:11.538
resident and the community. As many also have various

01:25:13.408 --> 01:25:15.408
disabilities. I am here to bring attention to title III

01:25:17.746 --> 01:25:19.746
under the Americans with disabilities act. Title III

01:25:21.183 --> 01:25:23.183
prohibits discrimination on the basis of disability and

01:25:24.653 --> 01:25:26.653
places of public accommodation, businesses that are

01:25:27.689 --> 01:25:29.689
generally open to the public, and fall into one of 12

01:25:32.427 --> 01:25:33.861
categories.
Listed in the ADA such as restaurants, movie theaters,

01:25:40.268 --> 01:25:42.268
schools, daycare facilities, recreation facilities and

01:25:45.207 --> 01:25:47.207
doctors offices. And requires newly constructed or

01:25:51.130 --> 01:25:53.130
altered places of public accommodations.

01:25:55.117 --> 01:25:57.117
As well as commercial facilities, privately owned

01:25:57.853 --> 01:26:00.788
non-residential facilities such as factories,
warehouses or office buildings to comply with the ADA

01:26:03.291 --> 01:26:05.291
standards. Some of these issues we found are that local

01:26:07.195 --> 01:26:09.195
government agencies and businesses are not well-versed

01:26:09.931 --> 01:26:11.931
on this issue. Even though county agencies in first

01:26:13.435 --> 01:26:15.435
responders now have compliance officers assigned to

01:26:16.171 --> 01:26:18.171
them they very often are not first on title III and do

01:26:20.842 --> 01:26:22.842
not appear to be sharing vital critical information.

01:26:23.979 --> 01:26:25.979
And I will share one personal story. Going into a new

01:26:28.250 --> 01:26:30.250
business in a brand-new wine and shopping center asking

01:26:31.753 --> 01:26:33.753
for accommodations and told we don't offer that. It is

01:26:35.657 --> 01:26:37.657
not an offer it is the law you are required to do this.

01:26:40.729 --> 01:26:42.729
I want to thank you inspector Bill Eaglin's for seeing

01:26:44.633 --> 01:26:46.633
this through. It came to my attention he was not made

01:26:48.904 --> 01:26:51.872
aware of the ADA compliance.
That that was the law. Which triggered something else. Meaning the ADA court Nader's and some of these

01:26:54.176 --> 01:26:56.176
agencies are not filtering the information and

01:26:56.745 --> 01:26:58.745
standards down to the staff for employees but that is

01:27:00.415 --> 01:27:02.415
another conversation that needs to be had at this

01:27:03.685 --> 01:27:05.685
point. In the end of it this particular DPIE paid the

01:27:07.723 --> 01:27:09.723
agency for issuance of you and those if a person has a

01:27:12.127 --> 01:27:14.127
complaint and one of the above establishment there is

01:27:15.430 --> 01:27:17.430
little to no information on any of the website. In

01:27:19.101 --> 01:27:21.101
which to file such a complaint. Residents are

01:27:22.370 --> 01:27:24.370
encouraged to go to 3-1-1e but it has no direct link

01:27:26.740 --> 01:27:28.740
for a category in which to do so. And there is no

01:27:30.479 --> 01:27:32.479
follow-up. And since Mr. McCarthy here mentioned

01:27:33.480 --> 01:27:35.480
3-1-one is rolling out yet again another 3-1-one mobile

01:27:36.351 --> 01:27:39.186
this is the second one.
Since its implementation.

01:27:40.388 --> 01:27:42.388
What is that 3-1-1 mobile app to use it for the persons

01:27:46.228 --> 01:27:48.228
of disabilities to see if it is accessible. I will

01:27:51.990 --> 01:27:53.567
close with that.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you Ms. Steele. Jon Robinson followed by Joan

01:28:02.711 --> 01:28:04.845
Fey.
You are up Mr. Robinson followed by Sheila I will say

01:28:11.119 --> 01:28:13.119
Burroughs is one of your relatives? I will say

01:28:17.580 --> 01:28:18.726
Burroughs.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you councilmembers I am here to speak

01:28:22.264 --> 01:28:24.264
about an issue that was mentioned. The geography of

01:28:26.368 --> 01:28:28.368
Prince Georges County has blessed or cursed it with a

01:28:30.939 --> 01:28:32.939
lot of wetlands and floodplains.

01:28:33.208 --> 01:28:35.208
There have been situations in the county where

01:28:37.846 --> 01:28:39.846
developers have areas that were wetlands declared is

01:28:42.450 --> 01:28:44.450
not wetlands but had personal experience with the

01:28:47.880 --> 01:28:49.880
spirit and it seems there should be some kind of

01:28:52.894 --> 01:28:54.894
penalty these companies that miss delineate what lands

01:28:57.499 --> 01:29:00.234
are repeat offenders.
The one I was involved with many years ago. I just

01:29:02.904 --> 01:29:04.904
looked up on the Internet that another delineation

01:29:05.607 --> 01:29:07.608
overturned in 2002.
Long after I dealt with him by the Army Corps of

01:29:12.113 --> 01:29:14.113
Engineers. I think it would be good for DPIE to do some

01:29:18.153 --> 01:29:20.153
follow-up and backup on some of these delineations that

01:29:22.691 --> 01:29:24.691
are provided. The citizens don't have a wherewithal to

01:29:27.195 --> 01:29:29.195
do their own delineation. A lot of it is being poorly

01:29:32.734 --> 01:29:34.734
done. You know the County residents, thank you.

01:29:36.738 --> 01:29:38.738
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you. Joan Fey followed by Sheila Burroughs.

01:29:44.145 --> 01:29:46.145
>> SPEAKER: Good evening my name is Joan Fey and the

01:29:48.416 --> 01:29:50.416
correspondence for the Association read back for the

01:29:51.519 --> 01:29:53.519
opportunity to speak with you tonight. One of the top

01:29:55.423 --> 01:29:57.423
priorities of our members is a well maintained and safe

01:29:59.294 --> 01:30:01.294
community. As they bring concerns to us and we bring

01:30:03.198 --> 01:30:04.565
3-1-
3-1-1 the system to enter details and photos of their

01:30:08.670 --> 01:30:10.670
concerns. We do track projectess of their cases and we

01:30:13.708 --> 01:30:15.708
track that progress. We have had many cases that have

01:30:18.780 --> 01:30:20.780
been resolved. And we have at inspectors and other DPIE

01:30:23.818 --> 01:30:26.353
employees with responses.
We had one case we know is not a quick process. And it

01:30:30.925 --> 01:30:32.925
is a process. It took more than a year probably two

01:30:35.630 --> 01:30:37.630
years but it did get resolved. There are other cases

01:30:39.901 --> 01:30:41.901
that come back quickly. Closed and no violation and one

01:30:44.205 --> 01:30:46.205
of these - while it is not inhabited right now is a

01:30:49.344 --> 01:30:51.344
residential home with vines growing up the front. Weeds

01:30:53.181 --> 01:30:55.181
in the gutter and a gaping hole in the roof. We are

01:30:58.320 --> 01:31:00.320
confounded by that result. And it is not the only

01:31:02.624 --> 01:31:04.624
thing. It is just one. And there are other cases that

01:31:07.329 --> 01:31:09.329
the concerns don't seem to be addressed at all. If

01:31:11.599 --> 01:31:13.599
entered months ago. And there appears to be no progress

01:31:15.904 --> 01:31:17.904
other than the case being created. And it is under

01:31:20.175 --> 01:31:22.175
investigation but there are no other notes no other

01:31:24.450 --> 01:31:26.450
progress but this is particularly frustrating because

01:31:27.480 --> 01:31:29.480
we have had contacts. Did not give us of days. Out of

01:31:32.187 --> 01:31:34.187
frustration we did right an order to the previous

01:31:36.240 --> 01:31:38.240
director that says no acknowledgment no response. It is

01:31:39.894 --> 01:31:41.894
really frustrating. Report back to the members. There

01:31:43.331 --> 01:31:45.331
appears to be no progress being made on these concerns.

01:31:47.602 --> 01:31:49.602
Some of them just seem to be on the bridge to nowhere.

01:31:52.741 --> 01:31:55.242
Thank you.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR:

01:31:57.450 --> 01:31:59.450
Thank you we have Sheila Burroughs, Tiana Woollard,

01:32:06.654 --> 01:32:08.654
CharCharlie, we wil go with Howl, and Shannon Gordon.

01:32:17.532 --> 01:32:19.532
. >> I am Tiana Woollard I have two questions the first

01:32:22.700 --> 01:32:24.700
question is I am in the process of opening an Arboretum

01:32:26.608 --> 01:32:28.608
that I am opening on my private property.

01:32:29.911 --> 01:32:31.911
Because I am not constricting any new buildings I was

01:32:34.883 --> 01:32:36.883
wondering if I still need to apply for a use and

01:32:40.388 --> 01:32:42.388
occupancy permit. The second question I had was for the

01:32:45.360 --> 01:32:47.360
program going on with all the new secret stealth

01:32:49.864 --> 01:32:51.864
cameras that will be put up to catch people littering.

01:32:54.836 --> 01:32:56.836
I was seeing how I get on that list for Millward Road

01:33:00.842 --> 01:33:02.842
another construction. We are behind it in there is a

01:33:05.814 --> 01:33:07.814
lot of dumping going on.

01:33:08.316 --> 01:33:10.316
I just had a minute left so I wanted a yes or no.

01:33:10.718 --> 01:33:12.718
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: We are all trying to get

01:33:15.857 --> 01:33:17.857
on the dumping list I've been trying 20 years to get my

01:33:21.463 --> 01:33:23.463
street. You are upper Marlboro.

01:33:23.798 --> 01:33:25.666
>> Is that district 9?
ne? Six?

01:33:30.171 --> 01:33:32.171
>> I am on Millwood Road.

01:33:38.580 --> 01:33:40.580
>> I have not.

01:33:43.718 --> 01:33:45.718
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: He can advocate for you to

01:33:46.254 --> 01:33:48.254
get on the dumping cameras list. And the UN no.

01:33:48.556 --> 01:33:50.556
>> Mr. Chair we will connect with Ms. Woodward with DOE

01:33:54.395 --> 01:33:56.395
that is running a program. So the Department of

01:33:59.200 --> 01:34:01.200
environment will be running the program. We note the

01:34:03.972 --> 01:34:05.972
area around route four is a concern. All of that area

01:34:09.811 --> 01:34:11.811
we will make sure.

01:34:11.946 --> 01:34:13.946
>> What about the UN oh? >> The UN no will have to talk about but the Arboretum

01:34:16.351 --> 01:34:18.351
is used for, how big it is. What is actual intention

01:34:20.388 --> 01:34:21.755
is.
>> SPEAKER: Follow up with DPIE?

01:34:32.867 --> 01:34:34.867
>> JARED McCARTHY: Happy to follow up with you. And I think anything north of Route four, councilmember, I believe is district six. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: I don't know where she is.

01:34:40.341 --> 01:34:42.341
I am from West floral. Yes, Charlie I cannot read your

01:34:47.849 --> 01:34:50.183
last name.
>> SPEAKER: Howell good evening my name is Charlie

01:34:53.421 --> 01:34:55.421
Howell I work with Charlie's I have worked in Prince

01:34:58.126 --> 01:35:00.527
Georges since DPIE.
While I understand many issues that others have brought

01:35:03.698 --> 01:35:05.165
up.
Just want to take the time appreciation to DPIE

01:35:10.538 --> 01:35:12.239
leadership.
And talk about improvements by how many folks are

01:35:18.780 --> 01:35:20.780
sitting here now. The permitting system. The peer

01:35:25.453 --> 01:35:27.453
review program. That is all I had.

01:35:31.326 --> 01:35:33.326
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr Howell. Has a permit

01:35:35.697 --> 01:35:37.998
stuck in DPIE.
Thank you for your positive comment. Ms. Jordan and

01:35:50.478 --> 01:35:52.478
then I cannot read this I apologize.

01:36:00.955 --> 01:36:02.955
Ms. Jordan? >> SPEAKER: Thank you my name is Shannon Jordan I am

01:36:03.825 --> 01:36:05.825
co-owner of mix and mingle coffee lounge opening soon

01:36:06.160 --> 01:36:08.160
in Clinton, Maryland. Lord willing and with the help of

01:36:08.763 --> 01:36:10.300
DPIE.
Ice will start off by saying I have utilize some of the

01:36:17.405 --> 01:36:19.405
BDS services so thank you for that.

01:36:22.310 --> 01:36:24.310
The small businesses especially the mom and pops. It

01:36:26.648 --> 01:36:28.648
was nice it had a timeline and was mentioned. Weeks and

01:36:31.986 --> 01:36:33.986
months for the permitting process. For all of the mom

01:36:36.824 --> 01:36:39.293
and pop businesses.
Especially if a new startup. And some of us have tried

01:36:42.363 --> 01:36:44.363
to take advantage of the state program to incentivize

01:36:45.700 --> 01:36:47.700
us to look at the vacant properties and work on those.

01:36:49.804 --> 01:36:51.804
And when you start with something that is been vacant

01:36:53.508 --> 01:36:55.508
for a while it is an unwilling process. And it is

01:36:57.578 --> 01:36:59.578
literally running us out of business before we can open

01:37:01.316 --> 01:37:03.500
the business.
I just want to ask. I know you're listening to

01:37:03.584 --> 01:37:04.751
complaints.
A suggestion. Networking events.

01:37:25.606 --> 01:37:28.176
And what you are paying is not open yet. If you make
changes that DPIE if there's a way to create a position
maybe that is the position you can create.

01:37:28.176 --> 01:37:30.176
Expedited on the inside. And that is expensive but that

01:37:32.413 --> 01:37:34.413
would really help. Maybe put a script in there for you

01:37:37.118 --> 01:37:39.118
flag stalled project. Sometimes it is something small

01:37:40.521 --> 01:37:42.521
and you are in that review process. When addressing

01:37:44.358 --> 01:37:46.358
things. It is turning back around maybe if there is a

01:37:49.300 --> 01:37:51.300
way to flag things through software. It is not as

01:37:53.301 --> 01:37:55.301
expensive as personal. If there is a way to supplement

01:37:57.538 --> 01:37:59.538
the state program that is giving grants to small

01:38:01.375 --> 01:38:03.375
businesses. The state program only goes so far to

01:38:05.213 --> 01:38:07.213
supplement the rent. But if you have a business owner

01:38:09.484 --> 01:38:11.484
that is near the finish line and the County can support

01:38:14.155 --> 01:38:16.155
it. I suggest that. I no all of this cost money. We

01:38:19.260 --> 01:38:21.260
know the infrastructure money is coming. Is there way

01:38:23.970 --> 01:38:25.970
to get that to DPIE. We will help lobby for that. We

01:38:28.236 --> 01:38:30.236
know that money is coming and I know what I am asking

01:38:33.341 --> 01:38:35.341
for takes resources. But literally we have business

01:38:36.778 --> 01:38:38.778
owners who are leaving to other jurisdictions but I

01:38:40.615 --> 01:38:42.615
just want to emphasize the need to support us and

01:38:44.852 --> 01:38:46.852
support economic development in our County. That is not

01:38:48.689 --> 01:38:50.689
a national chain but locally ownedowned.

01:38:51.259 --> 01:38:53.259
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Jordan have you contacted the economic development

01:38:56.564 --> 01:38:58.298
coronation?
That is where we keep the money.

01:39:02.637 --> 01:39:04.637
>> SPEAKER: Yes but it sounds like you need some money,

01:39:05.940 --> 01:39:07.940
DPIE need some money. We do know where that money is

01:39:09.210 --> 01:39:10.510
paid.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: If you wanted money that

01:39:12.513 --> 01:39:14.513
is where the grant money is paid in terms of DPIE this

01:39:16.150 --> 01:39:18.150
counsel is advocating heavily more funding for DPIE one

01:39:18.886 --> 01:39:20.886
of the first we said in December. We are on that part.

01:39:22.490 --> 01:39:24.900
Thank you.
>> SPEAKER: Thank you. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr.

01:39:25.626 --> 01:39:27.626
Hallid Salidsky . Then JD Perkins.

01:39:29.964 --> 01:39:31.964
>> Hello, I live 11202 Prospect Road. I have the same

01:39:38.940 --> 01:39:40.940
issue like Mr. Jared explaining a little bit. And also

01:39:47.114 --> 01:39:49.114
there was a citation I received last week on Tuesday by

01:39:56.900 --> 01:39:58.900
DPIE. The citation was about the TCP lines and I don't

01:40:05.990 --> 01:40:07.990
even know about that situation. And on my backyard.

01:40:12.440 --> 01:40:14.440
My backyard is on the front of my house. It ought of

01:40:18.479 --> 01:40:20.479
debris there were snakes. So many things come into my

01:40:23.517 --> 01:40:25.517
house. I have four kids. And a little bit and I put a

01:40:30.570 --> 01:40:32.592
shed over there.
Because of that I got a citation for that 2000. And

01:40:37.598 --> 01:40:39.598
also there was parking lot that was in front of my

01:40:43.638 --> 01:40:45.638
house. That was before I bought the house and this

01:40:49.110 --> 01:40:51.110
happen. Recently the inspector come to my house. Even

01:40:54.480 --> 01:40:56.480
as a citation that does not have any permit. And I

01:41:00.540 --> 01:41:02.540
don't even know if that was permitted or not. But did

01:41:06.600 --> 01:41:08.600
try to explain to me what is my boundary. So one I come

01:41:13.167 --> 01:41:15.167
over there and find anybody to help me through. I came

01:41:19.206 --> 01:41:21.206
over four, five times and nobody did give me any

01:41:24.679 --> 01:41:26.679
information. The TCP area that has to be kept.

01:41:29.584 --> 01:41:31.584
Continue do some construction.

01:41:37.124 --> 01:41:39.124
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you Mr.

01:41:39.660 --> 01:41:41.660
Hoslawski.

01:41:43.864 --> 01:41:45.864
. In terms of the parking pad PG has old aerial

01:41:53.174 --> 01:41:55.174
photography you can tell.

01:41:56.577 --> 01:41:59.379
>> JARED McCARTHY: It is possible for even residents to
go back and look at when construction may have

01:42:00.140 --> 01:42:01.181
occurred.
But on the tree conservation plan issue that is an

01:42:05.920 --> 01:42:07.920
unwitting trap for many homebuyers.

01:42:08.789 --> 01:42:10.789
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Which is why I've saved no new TCP lines.

01:42:17.365 --> 01:42:19.365
Mr. Perkins followed by Eleanor Whitson and laweanda

01:42:33.147 --> 01:42:36.116
Aldrich.
>> Good evening to the Council and Prince George's County. Residents who are here at this meeting my name is JD

01:42:36.384 --> 01:42:37.484
Perkins.
I the president of Dansville height citizen location

01:42:41.889 --> 01:42:43.889
that is located Bellesvelle in and a member of the

01:42:48.629 --> 01:42:50.629
movers and shakers of district 1e. My issue is 3-3-1-1.

01:42:55.403 --> 01:42:57.403
This is an issue regarding a single-family home that

01:43:00.975 --> 01:43:02.975
has been ongoing for years. But on several occasions as

01:43:07.148 --> 01:43:09.148
ours were closed without any apparent reason. And

01:43:12.530 --> 01:43:14.287
without resolution.
My concern is as follows. We have five service request.

01:43:19.460 --> 01:43:21.460
That are as ours. And depending on 3-

01:43:24.365 --> 01:43:26.365
3-1-1 the representative we speak with and have. And I

01:43:30.805 --> 01:43:32.805
have had to go through all five service requests.

01:43:36.577 --> 01:43:38.577
Before I get an accurate answer. All of the as ours

01:43:43.651 --> 01:43:45.651
refer to a single-family home that is that is to we are

01:43:51.358 --> 01:43:52.992
having.
>> April 21st-22. SR M like Mary 20-000-674.

01:44:02.136 --> 01:44:04.136
And then in 31 September of 2022 SR220063713.

01:44:14.515 --> 01:44:16.515
. Then again the same house on January five 2023 we

01:44:23.891 --> 01:44:25.891
call for a status called 3-1-1 for a status update. On

01:44:33.234 --> 01:44:35.234
these SR's only to be informed that.

01:44:39.206 --> 01:44:40.373
.
.

01:44:47.470 --> 01:44:48.715
only to be informed they do not necessarily connect
with each other in two different systems.
3-1-1 The complaints with the SR system.

01:44:57.124 --> 01:44:59.124
I don't want to take up Marmite and that is a lot of it

01:45:00.928 --> 01:45:02.928
but we have invested a lot of labor, intensive

01:45:03.330 --> 01:45:05.330
pertaining to this process and we don't have any

01:45:05.766 --> 01:45:08.368
response for any of the SR's.
They have all been resolved is what the issue was.

01:45:10.971 --> 01:45:12.971
We don't have any response.

01:45:16.143 --> 01:45:18.878
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.
Ms. Perkins, Woodson , followed by Lawana Aldridge and

01:45:33.661 --> 01:45:36.396
Frazier.
. >> Good evening my name is Eleanor Whitson from Lendale

01:45:39.600 --> 01:45:41.600
thank you for being here to listen to our concerns

01:45:43.771 --> 01:45:45.771
thank you for the gratitude of so many people in this

01:45:48.375 --> 01:45:49.776
room.
For the things you get right. Now will talk about the stuff you don't.

01:45:54.815 --> 01:45:56.815
The DPIE that we are most familiar with is the

01:45:59.119 --> 01:46:00.987
enforcement work.
Before I talk about that I want to say permitting

01:46:05.559 --> 01:46:07.559
inspections are vital to the County as well.

01:46:09.997 --> 01:46:11.997
To that end we ask you to help is much as you can in

01:46:16.270 --> 01:46:18.270
making sure that completely up to date on the data used

01:46:21.175 --> 01:46:23.175
to make environmental decisions. And that climate

01:46:24.311 --> 01:46:26.311
change and social justice are mandated considerations

01:46:27.448 --> 01:46:29.782
on any project.
Especially the wetlands. Of course we ask for honesty,

01:46:37.258 --> 01:46:39.258
responsiveness, transparency in our communications.

01:46:41.962 --> 01:46:43.962
In our town of Glendale increasingly homes in the

01:46:48.502 --> 01:46:50.502
residential area being purchased by business operators

01:46:53.607 --> 01:46:55.607
who turn their yards into service loss.

01:46:58.679 --> 01:47:00.679
Every third house has a businessbusiness. This has

01:47:07.870 --> 01:47:09.122
proliferated.
I know everybody has talked about that today. We have

01:47:12.893 --> 01:47:14.893
talked about it we have complained about it. And there

01:47:17.631 --> 01:47:19.631
are things that are still there. Nothing has been

01:47:21.936 --> 01:47:23.403
resolved.
The thing that comes to mind is the Beltway record that

01:47:24.271 --> 01:47:26.139
is parked in a driveway.
This is a poster child on the DPIE website for what you

01:47:32.460 --> 01:47:34.460
cannot have in your community. Let's see, in addition

01:47:37.251 --> 01:47:39.251
to that we have - and that by the way uses the

01:47:44.158 --> 01:47:46.158
elementary school parking lot as a staging area.

01:47:48.762 --> 01:47:50.762
It has been - I think 2021 and a number 3-1-1 of

01:47:54.335 --> 01:47:57.170
complaints without any resolutions.
Two doors from that there is a residents whose front

01:48:00.107 --> 01:48:02.107
yard has been completely covered with about a foot and

01:48:04.440 --> 01:48:06.646
a half of dirt.
Many, many dump loads.

01:48:07.848 --> 01:48:09.848
And this is that the edge of the park where it is a

01:48:13.454 --> 01:48:14.887
wetland.
So no permitting there.

01:48:17.991 --> 01:48:19.991
And it is owned now by a wood chip - I am sorry I'm

01:48:27.267 --> 01:48:29.267
having trouble because my glasses don't work for close

01:48:33.207 --> 01:48:35.541
up reading.
Let's see.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Eleanora. >> SPEAKER: I am out of time.

01:48:36.243 --> 01:48:38.243
My message is there is an awful lot that is happening

01:48:41.281 --> 01:48:43.281
it is happening in Glendale and we want you to know how

01:48:46.754 --> 01:48:49.122
crazy it is.
Thank you. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you, Eleanor.

01:48:50.557 --> 01:48:52.557
Lawanda Aldridge?

01:48:59.767 --> 01:49:01.767
>> SPEAKER: Thank you for letting me speak this is my

01:49:02.703 --> 01:49:04.703
first counsel when I entered I thought I was signing

01:49:05.339 --> 01:49:07.140
into the meeting.
Back for the opportunity to address you. I did not come for this I do not have anything planned.

01:49:11.678 --> 01:49:13.678
And not had much interaction with DPIE at all, or of my

01:49:16.650 --> 01:49:18.650
interactions more so recently. I am here on the worship

01:49:20.754 --> 01:49:22.754
center a church that has been in the PG County area

01:49:25.292 --> 01:49:27.292
since 2006. We brought property around that time to

01:49:28.996 --> 01:49:30.996
build a church in the tipper wrote location. We have

01:49:33.133 --> 01:49:35.133
since then been in a loop type process trying to figure

01:49:37.671 --> 01:49:39.671
out the permitting process to get this worship center

01:49:41.375 --> 01:49:43.375
built to support the community. And so we just about

01:49:45.479 --> 01:49:47.479
paid the property off waiting to get a permit. To get

01:49:50.170 --> 01:49:52.652
this worship center established.
And PG County is not necessarily in favor of building

01:49:57.958 --> 01:49:59.958
new churches and we get it. There are quite a few

01:50:04.865 --> 01:50:06.865
churches in the area and not churches are created

01:50:10.537 --> 01:50:12.537
equal. We are here to build a community. Our church has

01:50:17.444 --> 01:50:19.444
a vision to build the youth of PG County. We have

01:50:24.351 --> 01:50:26.351
tutoring, programs that we have. We are a small church

01:50:30.657 --> 01:50:32.657
but wanting to grow that for the community.

01:50:35.662 --> 01:50:37.731
Especially with all the challenges we face coming out
of COVID. Trying to get our youth built back up to
build a community backup right and get them to doing

01:50:37.731 --> 01:50:39.980
things more positive versus negative.
Addressing that boredom. We all know our children are

01:50:47.174 --> 01:50:49.174
coming home saying how poor they are.

01:50:54.248 --> 01:50:56.248
This is boring and things of that nature. We are trying

01:50:57.840 --> 01:50:59.840
to build activities that excite you to do more positive

01:50:59.653 --> 01:51:01.653
things but but we can't do it in the location we are in

01:51:03.230 --> 01:51:05.230
today. We are in an industrial area on Beach Road and

01:51:05.859 --> 01:51:07.859
we have been paying to rent and lease that facility

01:51:08.428 --> 01:51:10.428
since 2006. So we are literally paying for that

01:51:10.764 --> 01:51:12.764
location paying for the land at tipper wrote a doing

01:51:13.333 --> 01:51:15.333
everything we can to be patient. We are trying to do

01:51:16.169 --> 01:51:18.169
the things we believe is our God-given thing to do. And

01:51:19.600 --> 01:51:21.600
not trying to offend anybody here but we believe that

01:51:21.575 --> 01:51:23.575
is our purpose. But we need your help.

01:51:23.677 --> 01:51:25.677
Whatever help we can give whatever guidance we can get

01:51:26.847 --> 01:51:28.847
to give us this loop and get us to doing those things

01:51:30.651 --> 01:51:32.651
that matter in the community. Focusing on youth

01:51:33.186 --> 01:51:35.186
focusing on doing activities to a career program type

01:51:36.560 --> 01:51:38.560
activity. So help build career for youth even in middle

01:51:39.226 --> 01:51:41.226
school. I know that age is hard to figure out what it

01:51:43.300 --> 01:51:45.300
is I want to do when I grow up. But we have the tools

01:51:47.501 --> 01:51:49.501
that we have the people that are willing to help our

01:51:51.400 --> 01:51:53.573
youth figure those things out.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: You need to wrap up. Where

01:51:57.744 --> 01:52:00.146
is your church?
>> SPEAKER: Right now on Beach Road.

01:52:04.451 --> 01:52:06.451
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Were you trying to go? >>.

01:52:07.854 --> 01:52:10.256
>> To tipper wrote.
>> JARED McCARTHY: There is Ms.

01:52:17.331 --> 01:52:19.331
Paris right there is our parish liaison she can give

01:52:21.101 --> 01:52:23.101
you our car so we can reconnect.

01:52:23.737 --> 01:52:25.737
>> SPEAKER: Thank you for your time. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Frazier followed by Hudgins followed by Smith.

01:52:26.773 --> 01:52:28.773
>> SPEAKER: Good evening councilmembers, ladies and

01:52:31.144 --> 01:52:33.144
gentle men thank you for this opportunity to speak my

01:52:37.351 --> 01:52:38.985
truth.
I am Kim Frazier I have lived in the county for over 42

01:52:42.155 --> 01:52:43.456
years.
For the last 26 years I have lived in Glendale.

01:52:50.731 --> 01:52:52.731
I retired from the federal government in 2019 after 40 years of service. As a retiree I've had a lot more time to focus on the

01:52:56.303 --> 01:52:58.303
issues that concern many of our residents.

01:52:59.306 --> 01:53:01.306
Yes I have become a snitch.

01:53:15.122 --> 01:53:17.122
On a scale of one to ten, ten being the best my overall rating of DPIE is around three. I am not alone in that assessment just look on next

01:53:18.859 --> 01:53:20.859
door. Currently I have 15 complaints locked in PG 3-1-1

01:53:22.262 --> 01:53:24.262
all but two are closed I do not know why several of

01:53:26.333 --> 01:53:28.334
them were closed.
There was no action taken and if I did not call I did

01:53:31.738 --> 01:53:33.738
not call PG 3-1-1 to ask I would not know the full

01:53:35.776 --> 01:53:37.109
reason.
Of course I think DPIE should make those decisions

01:53:46.353 --> 01:53:48.353
apparent to the public.

01:53:50.924 --> 01:53:52.924
And to the residence especially to the complaining person. Why does DPIE use standards for enforcement and

01:53:53.326 --> 01:53:55.326
compliance that the public is not aware of every time I

01:53:56.663 --> 01:53:57.963
call?
They tell me something different. Why can't DPIE coordinate with the state when the issue

01:54:03.837 --> 01:54:05.837
is under DPIE purview?

01:54:06.606 --> 01:54:08.606
And crosses state lines print things like picking up

01:54:10.711 --> 01:54:12.711
trash on Glendale Road or 450. There is an overwhelming

01:54:15.282 --> 01:54:17.282
volume of trash. I never recall seeing this much trash

01:54:19.886 --> 01:54:21.886
in the county and for some reason people feel

01:54:23.990 --> 01:54:25.990
comfortable and being able to do that. I used to be

01:54:29.290 --> 01:54:31.290
proud to live in PGC now not so much. I drive on our

01:54:35.100 --> 01:54:37.100
roads I see sofas, beds, mattresses but I am

01:54:39.106 --> 01:54:41.106
increasingly frustrated and angry. I asked the Council

01:54:42.776 --> 01:54:44.776
to please consider reorganizing, restructuring,

01:54:45.780 --> 01:54:47.780
demolishing DPIE for something better.

01:54:47.347 --> 01:54:49.347
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Okay, thank you Ms. Hudgins, Greg Smith.

01:54:59.726 --> 01:55:01.726
>> Hello my name is Susan Hudgins I live in Glendale.

01:55:04.631 --> 01:55:06.631
My biggest concern. One of my biggest concerns is 3-1-1

01:55:09.690 --> 01:55:11.690
I have called since 2020 on multiple matters. Never to

01:55:13.540 --> 01:55:15.540
get any result. I was told someone would call me back

01:55:18.445 --> 01:55:21.213
and I get nothing.
I also want to speak to the customer service

01:55:23.150 --> 01:55:24.483
representative.
I live in a corporate law firm in corporate America and

01:55:28.288 --> 01:55:30.288
we would never speak to our clients the way the

01:55:32.692 --> 01:55:34.692
customer service reresp reps speak to citizens of the

01:55:36.630 --> 01:55:38.630
county. As we remind people that we trained, you are

01:55:41.340 --> 01:55:43.340
paid by your clients. I would recommend some better

01:55:44.971 --> 01:55:46.971
customer service trainingtraining. Lose the attitude,

01:55:47.607 --> 01:55:49.607
if you don't like your job find another job. Also if

01:55:52.412 --> 01:55:54.412
you need volunteers and bring people in on Saturday to

01:55:56.817 --> 01:55:58.817
retrain them I am more than happy to come in. And give

01:56:02.550 --> 01:56:04.550
your employees some better training on how to speak

01:56:05.992 --> 01:56:08.761
with customers. Thank you.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: I will take one second is

01:56:12.465 --> 01:56:13.899
Hudgins.
Great points. One thing I would recommend to folks,

01:56:18.705 --> 01:56:20.705
don't forget your counsel office but.

01:56:22.542 --> 01:56:24.542
>> SPEAKER: I called everybody.

01:56:28.381 --> 01:56:29.415
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR:
Okay. Mr. Smith, Mr. Smith.

01:56:42.829 --> 01:56:44.829
[Inaudible]

01:56:45.699 --> 01:56:47.699
[Off mic]

01:56:57.644 --> 01:56:59.644
>> Ma'am the cameras are not picking up you will have

01:57:00.580 --> 01:57:03.449
to make your comments at the microphone.
>> SPEAKER: When I lived in Eric Olson's district and

01:57:06.586 --> 01:57:08.586
his hard work. It was not just a lot of campaign talk,

01:57:11.558 --> 01:57:13.558
he backed up everything that he stated during his

01:57:15.295 --> 01:57:17.295
campaign. Other politicians that I have encountered

01:57:18.198 --> 01:57:20.198
since being in Glendale that is not the same thing. I

01:57:22.769 --> 01:57:24.769
have done everything all a aspirate and one more point

01:57:26.940 --> 01:57:28.940
I would like to make. I just had an addition made on

01:57:31.912 --> 01:57:33.912
the deck of my home. It took over four months to get

01:57:36.883 --> 01:57:38.717
the permit.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Hudgins you need to wrap up a just making a comment to

01:57:42.589 --> 01:57:44.589
the rest of the two talk about the Council office to

01:57:47.600 --> 01:57:49.600
generally help you that is all I was trying to say. Mr.

01:57:51.932 --> 01:57:54.533
Smith and Felton flowers.
>> SPEAKER: Good evening councilmembers and Councilman

01:57:57.700 --> 01:57:59.700
Burroughs to see you. Is that premature?

01:58:00.573 --> 01:58:02.573
Mr. McCarthy good to see you our last interaction was

01:58:03.877 --> 01:58:05.877
ten years ago when I called you when you were Deputy

01:58:07.514 --> 01:58:09.514
County attorney. To relate to you the six or seven type

01:58:11.151 --> 01:58:13.151
of violation I was running into with the public

01:58:14.120 --> 01:58:16.120
information act in a public agency. You expressed

01:58:16.756 --> 01:58:18.756
disbelief at each point is that I need to make a call

01:58:20.727 --> 01:58:22.727
you did. And we got some relief. I'm pretty familiar

01:58:24.300 --> 01:58:26.300
with the public information act and how it helped get

01:58:27.300 --> 01:58:29.300
admitted but I'm sure the phrase when hell freezes over

01:58:30.603 --> 01:58:32.603
does not appear in the act. And yet it should be seen

01:58:34.574 --> 01:58:36.574
as a problem on the public information request filed in

01:58:37.877 --> 01:58:39.877
September, August, September 2020 still have not gotten

01:58:40.513 --> 01:58:42.513
a response. No explanation as to whether or not there

01:58:43.817 --> 01:58:45.818
are documents available.
No request for an extension. Of documents. I think we

01:58:49.155 --> 01:58:51.155
can agree it is a problem. First of all thank you for

01:58:54.394 --> 01:58:56.394
advocating for additional resources to DPIE.

01:58:56.997 --> 01:58:58.997
Thank you for the hard work DPIE staff to try to do

01:59:01.568 --> 01:59:03.568
your job under circumstances but I have empathy for

01:59:05.500 --> 01:59:07.500
you. If you will give them more resources give them a

01:59:09.175 --> 01:59:11.175
clear mandate. Whether that is by amending the water

01:59:12.612 --> 01:59:15.514
resources ordinances. Tormenting the building
organizedce give them a clear mandate. Stop approving

01:59:17.584 --> 01:59:19.318
floodplain projects.
And start baking climate change into all your decisions

01:59:22.489 --> 01:59:24.489
fully in all your decisions. And start having it baked

01:59:27.930 --> 01:59:29.930
into the permitting decisions and enforcement decisions

01:59:30.330 --> 01:59:32.264
by DPIE.
It should be seen as a problem on the developer can

01:59:36.403 --> 01:59:38.403
violate county, state and law 28 years.

01:59:39.673 --> 01:59:41.673
Operate without permits in the floodplain. And yet get

01:59:43.376 --> 01:59:45.376
only three stop work orders and two notices of

01:59:47.470 --> 01:59:49.248
violations from DPIE.
Clearly, there is something wrong. There should be a problem when a developer operates

01:59:51.918 --> 01:59:53.918
repeatedly dumping sediment into people's yard curb to

01:59:55.221 --> 01:59:57.221
curb, curb height in the street and is allowed to

01:59:59.292 --> 02:00:01.292
continue work. These are chronic problems I have no

02:00:02.929 --> 02:00:04.929
reason to believe these two projects are unique or

02:00:06.599 --> 02:00:08.599
unusual in Prince George's County. Give them the

02:00:09.869 --> 02:00:11.869
resources and give them the mandate and give them the

02:00:13.940 --> 02:00:15.940
support they need to do their jobs fully, fairly and

02:00:18.110 --> 02:00:19.411
professionally.
Thank you very much. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: So I don't know but please

02:00:24.751 --> 02:00:27.486
contact Ms. Turner.
>> SPEAKER: Unit is but a more comprehensive I look

02:00:30.123 --> 02:00:32.123
forward to getting those documents ASAP.

02:00:32.325 --> 02:00:34.325
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr.

02:00:34.360 --> 02:00:36.360
Lori followed by Taylor and Cynthia Bauer.

02:00:39.165 --> 02:00:41.165
>> How many minutes first, thank you for putting this

02:00:42.168 --> 02:00:44.670
together it is long overdue.
My complaint is first I start working on my house

02:00:47.240 --> 02:00:50.800
trying to get it renovated.
I look at my watch and trying to get things.

02:00:54.647 --> 02:00:56.647
I had the roof put on and build a shed to get my

02:01:00.653 --> 02:01:02.653
toolbox and bring it home.

02:01:02.956 --> 02:01:04.956
So student paying storage fees.

02:01:11.531 --> 02:01:13.531
That a citation to stop work.

02:01:16.669 --> 02:01:18.669
And I cannot move it to complete my job over 2000 worth

02:01:20.507 --> 02:01:22.141
of work.
I get a citation for that. So I get a permit and lead

02:01:26.179 --> 02:01:28.179
to a diagram. So I did that. And they said no you need

02:01:31.184 --> 02:01:33.184
a site plan so I got a site plan. Came back and said

02:01:36.222 --> 02:01:38.222
that is not enough. You have to get an engineer and

02:01:40.493 --> 02:01:42.493
come out and expend everything. For a hurricane and all

02:01:44.330 --> 02:01:46.330
that kind of stuff. How can I afford all that I am

02:01:48.968 --> 02:01:50.968
living paycheck to paycheck. I just saying when the guy

02:01:52.839 --> 02:01:54.839
came out I met the guy. From DPIE he referred me to

02:01:57.477 --> 02:01:59.477
someone to come out and expend the details of what is

02:02:01.748 --> 02:02:03.748
required. And the city came and he came out before and

02:02:06.190 --> 02:02:08.190
give me another citation. What can I do, my truck is

02:02:10.290 --> 02:02:12.290
full of stuff I can't move it. And the ship is already

02:02:14.928 --> 02:02:16.928
built. The roof, deciding and the truck to keep it from

02:02:19.165 --> 02:02:21.165
getting damage. Anyone can help me outside the

02:02:22.268 --> 02:02:24.268
committee seems like I can't get no help. They say

02:02:26.139 --> 02:02:28.139
certain things but there is no accountability. So

02:02:29.209 --> 02:02:31.209
trying to figure out what I do. That is what I am

02:02:33.847 --> 02:02:35.847
saying just trying to get it completed. Just trying to

02:02:37.717 --> 02:02:39.717
get it completed to when I go away someone can help me

02:02:42.355 --> 02:02:44.355
with my problems but I'm a retired veteran and you know

02:02:46.626 --> 02:02:48.393
a veteran.
But I can't get no help. People laugh at me but they never tell me the truth. Thank you.

02:03:00.640 --> 02:03:02.640
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Carl tailored followed by Symphony power, Kelly James.

02:03:04.744 --> 02:03:06.744
>> SPEAKER: Good evening I am Charles Taylor.

02:03:09.716 --> 02:03:11.716
The Association Vice President.

02:03:12.285 --> 02:03:14.285
And mentioned operating in in a residential zone.

02:03:28.368 --> 02:03:30.368
An interesting story.

02:03:33.873 --> 02:03:36.742
And saw several advertised on Facebook.
And 83-1-1e address.

02:03:46.520 --> 02:03:48.520
A so-called residential address.

02:03:51.570 --> 02:03:53.570
It is a revolving door.

02:03:53.660 --> 02:03:55.660
And what is happening one has seen what they can get

02:03:56.562 --> 02:03:58.960
away with.
And then a whole bunch followed after.

02:04:00.867 --> 02:04:02.867
And then when there is no resolution.

02:04:05.171 --> 02:04:07.171
Delayed resolution.

02:04:08.941 --> 02:04:10.941
And so really a quandary.

02:04:18.785 --> 02:04:20.785
Along the road.

02:04:26.125 --> 02:04:28.125
I do appreciate the efforts.

02:04:29.963 --> 02:04:31.963
Several issues have been resolved.

02:04:35.401 --> 02:04:37.401
But the heavier businesses going up and down the

02:04:41.474 --> 02:04:43.141
street.
Kids and traffic.

02:04:43.876 --> 02:04:45.876
And other trucks not four x four but the regular

02:04:50.416 --> 02:04:52.840
F-150's.
Not so much them heavy trucks that go up and down the

02:05:00.560 --> 02:05:02.560
street at will.

02:05:02.929 --> 02:05:04.929
Between 7:30 a.m to 8:30 it is like a regular business

02:05:07.700 --> 02:05:09.968
hours for them.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr. Taylor just to be upfront, turn around.

02:05:16.175 --> 02:05:19.440
You did not leave an address or an email address so we
don't know how to get a hold of you.

02:05:19.445 --> 02:05:21.445
If you can give it to the clerk.

02:05:24.984 --> 02:05:26.984
Cynthia Bauer followed by Kelly James.

02:05:35.995 --> 02:05:37.995
>> Hi there I am Kelly James and my family and I are

02:05:39.999 --> 02:05:41.600
building -
in the process of building a new single-family home in

02:05:43.403 --> 02:05:46.710
the spring Meadows neighborhood in Maryland.
We have just received our building permit sediment,

02:05:50.376 --> 02:05:52.376
right-of-way, stormwater management everything you

02:05:53.713 --> 02:05:55.380
need.
But it took us two years to do it. And I am not one of those folks that has led things

02:05:57.750 --> 02:05:59.750
like with DPIE for weeks or months at a time.

02:06:00.586 --> 02:06:02.586
We have been an experienced architect.

02:06:03.156 --> 02:06:05.156
We have also got an experienced civil engineer and a

02:06:08.594 --> 02:06:10.162
builder.
What I think is happening is the DPIE staff who have

02:06:20.206 --> 02:06:22.206
been unfailingly knowledgeable and professional are

02:06:26.212 --> 02:06:28.212
prisoners of a process that they have no power to

02:06:36.222 --> 02:06:38.256
change.
For example if you build a new residence in Bowie, Maryland, there are two separate and independent permitting processes. One for the city of Billy one Prince George's County. They can't be even run concurrently.
My suggestion or question would be why did the two

02:06:42.161 --> 02:06:44.161
institutions not collaborate and update the permitting

02:06:45.598 --> 02:06:47.598
processes so you don't have to do one and I go back to

02:06:52.400 --> 02:06:54.400
the other that as at least five to six months to the

02:06:57.910 --> 02:06:59.411
process.
Also if staffing issues are problem in both agencies this is doing nothing but exacerbating those. Other things I think we are unlucky or things fall

02:07:01.470 --> 02:07:02.848
through the cracks.
For example there's a common area in the HOA that has

02:07:06.219 --> 02:07:08.219
to be deeded over to the HOA when finished.

02:07:09.789 --> 02:07:11.789
DPIE could not locate the date.

02:07:18.498 --> 02:07:20.499
I actually found the engineer that was sponsored for
the process 15 years ago who was still alive and

02:07:20.633 --> 02:07:21.766
practicing.
And he filled out a piece of paper from the bottom of

02:07:22.668 --> 02:07:24.135
his file cabinet.
Until that was result DPIE was not prepared to go

02:07:27.807 --> 02:07:29.274
forward.
We had a six week delay when at odds with DPIE if we

02:07:34.647 --> 02:07:36.647
can continue the permitting process at all.

02:07:38.840 --> 02:07:40.186
So I think there are low hanging fruit when it comes to
making the processes more efficient.

02:07:40.186 --> 02:07:42.186
Concurrent review for various permitting processes and

02:07:43.389 --> 02:07:45.389
reconciling the processes between city of Billy and the

02:07:47.493 --> 02:07:48.927
county.
Thank you.

02:07:50.696 --> 02:07:52.696
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.

02:07:54.267 --> 02:07:56.267
Next a little hard to read it looks like Beanito, Frank

02:07:57.670 --> 02:07:59.571
Jackson, Doug Rosen.
>>anito, Frank Jackson, Doug Rosen.

02:08:02.775 --> 02:08:04.775
>>.

02:08:08.180 --> 02:08:10.180
>> SPEAKER: That evening my name is Banito Braxton, in

02:08:16.255 --> 02:08:18.255
2000 I decided to move into Tribeca in 2007.

02:08:23.496 --> 02:08:25.496
Retired in 2005.

02:08:26.465 --> 02:08:28.465
When I moved in there there were major construction

02:08:30.803 --> 02:08:32.803
issues, elevators that opened the did not have an

02:08:35.107 --> 02:08:37.107
elevator in it. We were blessed to get attorney Nick

02:08:39.912 --> 02:08:41.912
Howey a construction defect attorney I am sure many of

02:08:44.750 --> 02:08:46.750
you know him. He came in and lead DPIE no the Tribeca

02:08:50.523 --> 02:08:52.523
did not even meet minimum code requirements.

02:08:53.893 --> 02:08:55.893
To make a long story short he sued the developer, he

02:08:58.764 --> 02:09:00.764
put DPIE on notice, and a lot of the contractors. From

02:09:03.603 --> 02:09:05.603
that we got repairs made and close to 1 million in

02:09:08.474 --> 02:09:10.474
funds. When the developer left most of the money went

02:09:12.912 --> 02:09:14.912
with him. Fast forward to today. There are still major

02:09:17.350 --> 02:09:18.783
issues.
I have even told by an engineer that back in 2010 that

02:09:23.656 --> 02:09:25.656
eventually the garage is going to pull away from the

02:09:28.561 --> 02:09:30.561
five buildings. Tribeca is a five building complex but

02:09:32.965 --> 02:09:34.965
fast forward to today. The issues have gotten so bad in

02:09:38.337 --> 02:09:40.337
2022 went to DPIE and put over 22 complaints. We had it

02:09:44.210 --> 02:09:46.210
inspector come out. She came out minor things were done

02:09:49.115 --> 02:09:51.115
but the major ones weren't. One of the major ones that

02:09:54.487 --> 02:09:56.955
still exist today.
Because we did go back into Councilman Burroughs's

02:10:01.727 --> 02:10:04.195
office -
I am sorry barrel's office. We were assigned from DPIE

02:10:12.405 --> 02:10:14.339
Mr.
Hinton and Mr. Bro. We went back in with major issues

02:10:15.608 --> 02:10:17.608
but one of the major issues is that fire department

02:10:17.643 --> 02:10:19.477
police cannot get up.
I live in 4703. I have had heart and breathing issues.

02:10:23.249 --> 02:10:25.249
And I can't understand why you think it is necessary to

02:10:28.200 --> 02:10:30.200
walk down a hall down the elevator to get the fire

02:10:32.758 --> 02:10:34.758
department or even to call one of my neighbors. I would

02:10:37.563 --> 02:10:39.563
have been dead three times by now. At this point like I

02:10:42.768 --> 02:10:44.768
said we went back into DPIE in November. The issues are

02:10:47.540 --> 02:10:49.540
still there especially we asked them to address two

02:10:51.444 --> 02:10:53.444
issues. Which is the call box in the trash. Which

02:10:55.748 --> 02:10:57.748
smells up the whole building.

02:10:57.917 --> 02:10:59.917
Right now the issue has not been resolved. I cannot get

02:11:03.189 --> 02:11:05.189
any answer as to what is going on.

02:11:07.260 --> 02:11:09.260
My other concern there are 22-30 major issues at

02:11:11.970 --> 02:11:13.970
Tribeca. When you go into 3-1-1 is there a way to have

02:11:16.502 --> 02:11:18.502
all those issues addressed or do we have to put them in

02:11:21.907 --> 02:11:23.341
separate?
Before they did 3-1-1ne I put these issues in and now

02:11:24.944 --> 02:11:26.944
they are not showing up in the new system. So what is

02:11:27.747 --> 02:11:29.747
the process1 I put these issues in and now they are not

02:11:30.583 --> 02:11:32.583
showing up in the new system. So what is the process do

02:11:33.385 --> 02:11:35.385
I start again? My major issue is that call box.

02:11:35.755 --> 02:11:37.755
That is a health, life and safety issue paid.

02:11:38.491 --> 02:11:40.491
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.

02:11:50.903 --> 02:11:52.903
>> We will follow up again I will give Mr. Byrd a call

02:11:56.275 --> 02:11:58.275
in my office. If a number of District eight

02:11:59.979 --> 02:12:02.213
constituents speak today.
Our office you can always reach out to us but what I tell you is DPIE is the agency at the County executive. We have three branches of government and our counsel

02:12:05.317 --> 02:12:07.317
offices are inundated with constituent request trying

02:12:08.521 --> 02:12:10.521
to navigate the same 311 system and working with DPIE.

02:12:13.580 --> 02:12:15.580
With the same frustration you had we will continue to

02:12:17.696 --> 02:12:19.696
do our best to follow up.

02:12:20.466 --> 02:12:22.466
>> SPEAKER: Thank you.

02:12:24.270 --> 02:12:26.270
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Frank Justin, is Frank Jackson here?

02:12:29.975 --> 02:12:31.975
Pass it on.

02:12:32.878 --> 02:12:34.878
Okay with Franklin Jackson speak earlier maybe that

02:12:37.817 --> 02:12:39.417
counts.
Melanie Hardwick Avis are you here?

02:12:42.888 --> 02:12:44.888
Come Mr Roser . You are a.

02:12:47.660 --> 02:12:49.660
>> SPEAKER: Good evening I would like to thank you you

02:12:52.598 --> 02:12:54.598
for having the supported rating my name is Douglas

02:12:56.635 --> 02:12:58.635
Roser, I just want to take a moment and say are

02:13:01.540 --> 02:13:03.540
committee as a whole is committed to make changes in

02:13:06.110 --> 02:13:08.110
Prince George's County and we are working and list to

02:13:10.482 --> 02:13:12.482
solve some of the issues I sat here and heard from

02:13:15.421 --> 02:13:17.421
residents of Prince Georges County.

02:13:17.656 --> 02:13:19.656
Are biggest thing that we see as staff on the board's

02:13:24.930 --> 02:13:26.930
lack of inspectors to follow up on what we do at the

02:13:32.872 --> 02:13:34.872
board level to close businesses and ensure the safety

02:13:38.844 --> 02:13:40.844
and well-being of residents of Prince George's County.

02:13:44.116 --> 02:13:46.116
It is a big thing, another thing is holding the people

02:13:49.688 --> 02:13:51.688
that we find accountable for their fines. To do

02:13:54.260 --> 02:13:56.260
something that we can get revenue from businesses and

02:13:58.797 --> 02:14:00.797
from owners that are operating businesses illegal in

02:14:02.835 --> 02:14:04.835
Prince George's County. But we have to ensure that the

02:14:07.907 --> 02:14:09.907
fines are guaranteed before they open up their

02:14:11.944 --> 02:14:13.444
businesses.
And then third and final thing is just to make sure

02:14:21.860 --> 02:14:23.860
that the businesses follow the guidelines and

02:14:26.592 --> 02:14:28.592
requirements to reopen the businesses.

02:14:30.529 --> 02:14:32.529
As well as the resident that are operating or renting

02:14:35.734 --> 02:14:37.734
facilities within our County. The main thing is just

02:14:40.472 --> 02:14:42.472
please, help DPIE get more employees. Help us be able

02:14:45.678 --> 02:14:47.678
to ensure the fines that are given the county is given

02:14:51.483 --> 02:14:53.483
back. And just support us like we support you. Thank

02:14:56.722 --> 02:14:59.290
you so much.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Hardwick Davis. And Adrian Crowell.

02:15:06.532 --> 02:15:08.532
>> Good evening. Thank you it is great to see some of

02:15:10.302 --> 02:15:12.302
you the first time in a while I am Melanie

02:15:13.405 --> 02:15:15.405
Hardwick-Davis I start my architectural firm at 3201

02:15:15.941 --> 02:15:17.941
Bellevue Avenue and Chevrolet over 25 years ago. So I

02:15:19.440 --> 02:15:21.440
have a bit of history as an architect I do primarily

02:15:22.514 --> 02:15:24.749
residential additions and renovations.
And I was deeply ingrained at the birth of DPIE many

02:15:36.362 --> 02:15:38.362
years ago.

02:15:38.630 --> 02:15:39.664
I applaud you for continuing to push the boundaries and
make improvements. As I tell my clients it always gets worse before it

02:15:43.969 --> 02:15:45.969
gets better. We just have got to push through this. I

02:15:49.308 --> 02:15:51.308
want to speak to a comment about economic development

02:15:53.646 --> 02:15:55.646
and inspections have been a theme. And that is one of

02:15:58.984 --> 02:16:00.984
my it is difficult over 25 years to have quality

02:16:03.822 --> 02:16:05.822
contractors who will work in this county.

02:16:07.226 --> 02:16:09.226
I have been bringing over some days I get to come over

02:16:10.262 --> 02:16:12.262
here. As soon as I start to hear from them the

02:16:13.650 --> 02:16:15.867
inspectors are absurdly difficult I get really
concerned but because I get to the quality of work that

02:16:17.669 --> 02:16:19.669
I do that my company does in Prince George's County.

02:16:20.239 --> 02:16:22.239
And I can't have good contractors and good contractors

02:16:22.508 --> 02:16:24.508
to want to work in this county that I can't get it

02:16:25.577 --> 02:16:27.577
built. I've had complete horror stories over the years

02:16:27.880 --> 02:16:29.880
as you can imagine. So I recently had a contractor in

02:16:30.682 --> 02:16:32.682
Chevrolet going to be a LEED GoGold house, in the

02:16:33.252 --> 02:16:35.252
contractors and thankfully the chief inspector has been

02:16:35.287 --> 02:16:37.287
very responsive but I need to give you a heads up about

02:16:38.357 --> 02:16:40.357
that. I would also say we are getting many comments

02:16:40.893 --> 02:16:42.893
back on our permits that don't make sense but I don't

02:16:43.696 --> 02:16:45.696
know if there is a language barrier. Like I said I have

02:16:46.765 --> 02:16:48.765
been doing this a while I feel I know the answers. I

02:16:49.835 --> 02:16:51.835
really miss meeting face to face with them. Often it is

02:16:52.638 --> 02:16:54.638
a matter of explaining what they may not understand in

02:16:55.174 --> 02:16:56.707
the drawings.
And wonder if there is a possibility of Zoom and screen

02:17:11.457 --> 02:17:13.457
share with reviewers rather than weeks of

02:17:21.433 --> 02:17:23.433
back-and-forth with incomplete comments.

02:17:27.139 --> 02:17:29.139
Since I am out of time and one more this is absurd but driving me crazy for years. And I hope I am wrong correct me if I am wrong. Do you know what this is? It is a mini set. This many said can you see what project that is? No you can't. Because according to Prince Georges County you have to

02:17:29.475 --> 02:17:31.475
give five inches on the edge of your drawings over for

02:17:32.277 --> 02:17:34.277
stamps. Never those who don't know architectural the

02:17:34.346 --> 02:17:36.346
title block goes into space so we can immediately look

02:17:36.915 --> 02:17:38.915
and see. Please tell me I am wrong but I have that

02:17:39.985 --> 02:17:41.985
staff call and we have gotten online. As far as I can

02:17:43.880 --> 02:17:45.880
tell we still have to get the county five inches of our

02:17:46.158 --> 02:17:48.158
drawings where it is supposed to be a title block we

02:17:48.961 --> 02:17:50.961
can read we are working with and who we are working

02:17:51.797 --> 02:17:53.797
for. And then the county people don't stamp it in that

02:17:54.633 --> 02:17:56.633
5 inches. So baby someone to look into this and it is

02:17:57.703 --> 02:18:00.400
been going on for years.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr. McCarthy that is for you. Mr. Smith followed by Adrian Crowell.

02:18:06.440 --> 02:18:08.440
>> Hello my name is Jim Smith and from the community of

02:18:08.213 --> 02:18:10.314
Marlborough it is and the president.
And I no you have heard this all night.

02:18:17.422 --> 02:18:19.422
But I have to say it because I can't go back to my

02:18:20.726 --> 02:18:23.227
community if I don't say something.
And they may have Spicer watching me anyway so I will

02:18:24.290 --> 02:18:25.363
say it.
We don't have an HOA in our community so we have to

02:18:29.701 --> 02:18:31.701
depend on the County goes to keep our neighborhoods.

02:18:33.739 --> 02:18:35.739
Our neighborhood was built in 1969. It is doing pretty

02:18:38.177 --> 02:18:40.177
good but now it is starting to flight because of code

02:18:43.810 --> 02:18:44.549
enforcement.
Now I do like 3-1-one.

02:18:46.285 --> 02:18:48.285
You can put in your service request really quickly.

02:18:50.255 --> 02:18:52.255
My problem is the tickets being closed.

02:18:54.226 --> 02:18:56.226
We have tickets two and three years old.

02:18:57.296 --> 02:18:59.296
From the old system.

02:19:03.869 --> 02:19:06.237
And they are just closed. The question is who is doing the closing of these
tickets?
So we think no maybe it is the inspector.

02:19:09.374 --> 02:19:11.374
So we are finding out where the question is to the

02:19:13.812 --> 02:19:15.812
inspectors have the training that they need to make

02:19:17.416 --> 02:19:19.416
decisions on which tickets they close and which tickets

02:19:21.530 --> 02:19:23.254
they don't close?
One example we have a ten wheel tractor in the

02:19:26.792 --> 02:19:28.792
neighborhood with no tax. An inspector went out there

02:19:30.862 --> 02:19:32.862
and said I found it has tags on it so he closed the

02:19:36.768 --> 02:19:38.236
case.
He did not even think about that truck is not supposed

02:19:41.773 --> 02:19:43.773
to be there it is a commercial vehicle.

02:19:45.110 --> 02:19:47.110
But he closed that. And we can't find out where these tickets are being

02:19:51.683 --> 02:19:53.317
closed.
We just want to get our tickets taking care of.

02:19:57.823 --> 02:19:59.823
We thank you very much.

02:20:00.926 --> 02:20:02.926
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.

02:20:06.640 --> 02:20:08.640
Ms. Crowell a quick question on your email address. Is it ll's, two it is two in your name but only one.

02:20:12.838 --> 02:20:14.838
>> SPEAKER: Only one.

02:20:16.475 --> 02:20:18.475
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Just make sure I get it right. >> SPEAKER: Thank you are having this town hall forum.

02:20:22.648 --> 02:20:24.648
The first issue I would like to address is economic

02:20:28.887 --> 02:20:30.521
development.
In the historic area of Clinton, Maryland. Predominantly my particular concern is Clinton

02:20:32.724 --> 02:20:34.724
marketplace North and South which is snaking through

02:20:36.962 --> 02:20:38.962
our community egress in on Piscataway and Woodward

02:20:41.199 --> 02:20:42.733
Road.
And it is already gridlocked.

02:20:44.836 --> 02:20:46.836
As we speak with more development and upheaval.

02:20:51.743 --> 02:20:53.743
Greenhouse gases, inability of our children to walk at

02:20:59.451 --> 02:21:01.285
transfers.
That community right next to SaSaratsville high school

02:21:06.325 --> 02:21:08.325
and the students are getting out of school.

02:21:12.364 --> 02:21:14.466
And we have this housing development in the plans we
have been fighting for so long.

02:21:14.466 --> 02:21:16.466
That are still on the books.

02:21:18.737 --> 02:21:20.737
Secondly I would like to address DPIE.

02:21:21.707 --> 02:21:23.707
And I would like to say DPIE should be able - the

02:21:26.478 --> 02:21:28.478
inspector should be able to address issues that are

02:21:30.820 --> 02:21:32.820
visual without having us callus call 311.

02:21:32.851 --> 02:21:34.851
311 is labor-intensive if we notice an inspector in our

02:21:37.856 --> 02:21:39.856
community checking on an issue I put with a house that

02:21:43.328 --> 02:21:45.328
has been just out of code for so long.

02:21:47.799 --> 02:21:49.799
And there have been many and more that have been

02:21:52.504 --> 02:21:53.971
submitted.
But the problem still goes on.

02:21:55.741 --> 02:21:57.741
Even, you know, neighbors with the community with their

02:22:00.712 --> 02:22:02.279
backyard.
We don't have an HOA we are a historic community.

02:22:05.684 --> 02:22:07.684
And we have historic property within our confines.

02:22:11.230 --> 02:22:13.230
So we have people moving in that are doing everything.

02:22:22.734 --> 02:22:24.734
Even though it is turned and we need support. Not only from DPIE but from counsel - County

02:22:25.704 --> 02:22:27.370
councilmembers.
And that is all I have, thank you.

02:22:32.100 --> 02:22:33.440
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you.
Amy small followed by Jason Carter that is the last

02:22:41.253 --> 02:22:43.253
person who signed up.

02:22:44.956 --> 02:22:47.458
>> SPEAKER: That is not the last person who signed up. >> SPEAKER: Good afternoon thank you for having me.
I no it is a problem with 311 another's a problem with

02:22:55.834 --> 02:22:57.601
DPIE.
I have this one issue I have been working on 20 years

02:22:58.470 --> 02:23:00.704
at a not had anyone to correct it.
In the issue is what is compliance property? You say

02:23:06.511 --> 02:23:08.511
come in compliance but you allow people to put corn and

02:23:13.985 --> 02:23:15.985
vegetation in their front yards.

02:23:17.422 --> 02:23:19.423
And he said there is no problem.
It is a problem. Vegetation and corn is a form product

02:23:23.195 --> 02:23:25.195
but we do not live in a farm area.

02:23:27.650 --> 02:23:29.650
Therefore it is not legal to plant corn and vegetation

02:23:30.969 --> 02:23:32.969
in your front yard. Now I have been in that community

02:23:35.273 --> 02:23:37.273
since 1975 a beautiful community. Now the thing of it

02:23:39.177 --> 02:23:41.177
is if you look at the audience you don't see the people

02:23:43.882 --> 02:23:45.882
that need to be educated in here. We know what it is

02:23:48.553 --> 02:23:50.553
that is going on. And these little information you give

02:23:52.457 --> 02:23:54.457
us your giving it to the wrong people.

02:23:55.594 --> 02:23:57.594
They should be given to the people who have moved in

02:23:59.431 --> 02:24:01.431
the community. That do not know the law. They do not

02:24:03.235 --> 02:24:05.235
know they can't grow corn they do not know but they

02:24:07.380 --> 02:24:09.380
can't have 15 to 20 people in their household. They do

02:24:10.876 --> 02:24:12.876
not know but my question is how are you going to get

02:24:15.460 --> 02:24:17.414
that information to them?
I know when it comes for time to vote for poor people

02:24:23.880 --> 02:24:25.880
we have mail coming in our mailbox everyday vote for

02:24:28.660 --> 02:24:30.660
me, for for me but then you don't want to educate the

02:24:35.333 --> 02:24:37.333
people were from another country that bring all of

02:24:40.338 --> 02:24:42.338
their cultures with them.

02:24:42.574 --> 02:24:44.743
How do you tell them you cannot plant corn, you cannot
have chickens. I have people calling me all David I
have chickens in the backyard how do we get rid of the

02:24:44.743 --> 02:24:46.343
chickens? How do we get rid of the corn?
Corn attracts mice. We have mice running through our

02:24:50.582 --> 02:24:52.582
house all the time.

02:24:52.918 --> 02:24:54.918
And so my issue is I know it is a big problem. Okay,

02:24:58.256 --> 02:25:00.256
with DPIE most definitely with 311 I just want the corn

02:25:02.761 --> 02:25:04.761
out of my community. I want the chickens out of my

02:25:07.265 --> 02:25:09.265
community. I want to be able to have someone come over

02:25:11.803 --> 02:25:13.803
and look at my property and give me my property value.

02:25:16.308 --> 02:25:18.308
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Okay, Ms. Moore. >> CALVIN S. HAWKINS, II: Thank you.

02:25:21.279 --> 02:25:23.279
>> You said you wanted ten seconds you tricked us. Mr. Carter then Ms. Burroughs. I called your name earlier

02:25:26.985 --> 02:25:28.985
but it is okay. It is okay.

02:25:31.489 --> 02:25:33.489
>> SPEAKER: Good evening everyone my name is Jason

02:25:35.660 --> 02:25:37.660
CarterCarter. I am a construction standard of DPIE but

02:25:39.831 --> 02:25:41.831
currently have a labor relations specialist. And I

02:25:43.568 --> 02:25:45.568
represent the workers at DPIE. It worked out great I

02:25:48.206 --> 02:25:50.206
went last because it gave me an opportunity to hear

02:25:52.844 --> 02:25:54.844
many of the concerns of our citizens. And what it came

02:25:57.949 --> 02:25:59.949
down to most of all is a lack of human resources,

02:26:03.540 --> 02:26:05.540
people. And it is great to note this counsel body is

02:26:08.159 --> 02:26:10.159
receptive to getting DPIE a part of resources but I

02:26:12.831 --> 02:26:14.831
wanted to take a moment. Give some examples of just how

02:26:17.936 --> 02:26:19.936
bad it is. And I will talk about enforcement today.

02:26:22.574 --> 02:26:24.574
This is something that spans the entirety of DPIE. But

02:26:27.212 --> 02:26:29.212
you hovered a lot about enforcement so I will

02:26:31.383 --> 02:26:33.383
concentrate on enforcement. And I will talk about the

02:26:35.587 --> 02:26:37.521
single-family housing.
So the northern part of the county which basically runs

02:26:42.394 --> 02:26:44.394
from Central Avenue all the way to Montgomery county.

02:26:47.666 --> 02:26:49.666
That section has seven inspectors.

02:26:50.602 --> 02:26:52.602
Seven inspectors to cover just north of Central Avenue

02:26:53.838 --> 02:26:55.838
all the way to Montgomery county.

02:26:55.974 --> 02:26:57.974
The central area. Seven inspectors.

02:27:04.716 --> 02:27:06.716
That central area covers the Marlborough by quarter. We are talking about Capitol Heights, Fairmount

02:27:08.920 --> 02:27:10.920
Heights, areas of the county that are densely populated

02:27:14.325 --> 02:27:16.527
with homes.
And here is the crazy. The south part of the county that is everything

02:27:19.764 --> 02:27:21.764
basically North of Route four on the Beltway down to

02:27:24.502 --> 02:27:27.404
the Woodrow Wilson Bridge.
We are talking about the 301 quarter south of Bowie.

02:27:31.776 --> 02:27:34.278
And as far east as Eva Harper anyone know where Eva
Harper is?
They have seven inspectors to cover the entirety of

02:27:38.216 --> 02:27:40.216
that area I just spoke about.

02:27:41.453 --> 02:27:43.453
And anybody who is lived in this county and those this

02:27:44.723 --> 02:27:46.723
county like I do note that seven is not nearly enough

02:27:48.260 --> 02:27:50.494
to cover such expensive area.
They have four inspectors and they can.

02:27:55.734 --> 02:27:57.734
It is my understanding the County currently has some

02:27:58.837 --> 02:28:00.837
are in the area of 4000 vacant homes.

02:28:01.573 --> 02:28:03.573
And we have four inspectors who are responsible for

02:28:06.911 --> 02:28:08.911
making sure these vacancies are made safe.

02:28:11.490 --> 02:28:13.490
We need more people. Technology is one of them and wonderful but without the

02:28:19.900 --> 02:28:21.900
people these problems aren't going anywhere.

02:28:23.928 --> 02:28:26.164
Thank you for your time. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Mr. Carter? >> SPEAKER: Yes, sir.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: You hit the nail on your
head but you are not last.

02:28:26.164 --> 02:28:28.164
Ms. Burroughs's neck and behind you.

02:28:31.202 --> 02:28:33.202
>> [!EZ SPEAKER 30]: Hello everyone.

02:28:36.174 --> 02:28:38.174
First I want to say I love Maryland.

02:28:38.576 --> 02:28:40.576
I had a house built here and in 2020 I think.

02:28:45.650 --> 02:28:47.650
The cited building property that abuts my house with 27

02:28:52.190 --> 02:28:53.857
homes.
And on the other side of my house 28. But in the process of doing that they should my home in

02:28:58.696 --> 02:29:00.696
the middle of having COVID.

02:29:01.132 --> 02:29:03.132
With anxiety and everything else.

02:29:07.806 --> 02:29:09.806
I was with my bed shaking literally. Literally shaking. This went on seven to eight months.

02:29:11.443 --> 02:29:13.443
When I said something to the builder and the people,

02:29:15.547 --> 02:29:17.547
their attitude was ma'am, what do you want us to do?

02:29:20.510 --> 02:29:22.510
When I called DPIE and I actually started crying the

02:29:24.155 --> 02:29:26.155
man told me. He said they have a right to build. And I

02:29:29.494 --> 02:29:31.494
said to myself do I have a right to keep my own

02:29:34.432 --> 02:29:36.432
property from being damaged? If you have a right to

02:29:38.536 --> 02:29:40.536
build and I have a right to protect my existing

02:29:42.640 --> 02:29:44.441
property, okay?
Nothing was done. And to add insult to injury when they

02:29:48.112 --> 02:29:50.112
came out there approach was I am a liar. I have been in

02:29:53.618 --> 02:29:55.618
this home 28 years going on 29 so therefore I know

02:29:58.256 --> 02:30:00.256
nothing about my home, I know nothing about my house I

02:30:02.894 --> 02:30:04.894
know nothing about the ground around it or anything.

02:30:06.664 --> 02:30:08.664
Okay, they found fault with everything. Being my fault.

02:30:10.468 --> 02:30:12.468
So I felt like you victimized me and called me a liar.

02:30:16.274 --> 02:30:18.274
Now, come to find out the builder that is building this

02:30:21.880 --> 02:30:23.880
actually got sued in the district for faulty homes.

02:30:26.484 --> 02:30:28.484
Actually found out they are -

02:30:32.457 --> 02:30:34.457
forgive me for the post COVID stuff. When they - thank

02:30:37.795 --> 02:30:39.296
you.
Okay.

02:30:40.365 --> 02:30:42.365
I have been fighting with him because he keeps telling

02:30:44.135 --> 02:30:46.135
me he will help me. Forgive me for being loyal is a

02:30:48.673 --> 02:30:50.673
Christian brother I am trusting. But it is going on two

02:30:52.844 --> 02:30:54.844
years. I just found out recently I have a three year

02:30:57.150 --> 02:30:59.150
time limit before I file. I don't even know where

02:31:00.818 --> 02:31:02.818
because during that time when I was looking for people

02:31:04.589 --> 02:31:06.589
to come assess things. They wouldn't come because of

02:31:08.260 --> 02:31:10.260
either the ZIP Code, the residents or whatever they

02:31:11.429 --> 02:31:13.429
just would not come. Now the house. All of the houses

02:31:15.600 --> 02:31:17.600
they built over there than the situation they put up a

02:31:19.771 --> 02:31:21.771
fence but they already knew there was a water pipe

02:31:23.541 --> 02:31:25.541
underneath the road that keeps the water from off my

02:31:27.345 --> 02:31:29.345
neighbors husband because when my neighbors house fills

02:31:30.348 --> 02:31:32.348
up with water it fills up my sump pump and my house

02:31:34.919 --> 02:31:36.919
let's do that two years but what did I do? Is somebody

02:31:39.457 --> 02:31:41.457
come in and dig up the road and put a bigger pipe it

02:31:44.395 --> 02:31:46.395
has been working fine have not had a flood since then.

02:31:48.566 --> 02:31:50.566
But he puts up a fence over top of thisthis. Who puts -

02:31:53.504 --> 02:31:55.504
what do you call the rain for the water comes into on

02:31:58.420 --> 02:32:00.420
residential people's property in the first place?

02:32:00.712 --> 02:32:02.712
So the guy takes the event he put start up in it. And I

02:32:07.180 --> 02:32:09.180
am telling the builder take the dirt out. Come to find

02:32:11.956 --> 02:32:13.956
out the neighbor has dogs. And the dogs can get under

02:32:16.894 --> 02:32:18.894
there. Right now I am praying that the flood we had one

02:32:22.300 --> 02:32:24.300
time before 40 years does not come again but because if

02:32:27.271 --> 02:32:29.271
it does the water will not go anywhere because the dirt

02:32:32.210 --> 02:32:34.210
is all the way back into the pipe. You guys.

02:32:36.714 --> 02:32:39.583
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Ms. Burroughs? >> [!EZ SPEAKER 30]: I know I will make this short. >> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: He will be happy to talk to you afterward. >> SPEAKER: Please, because yes.
I am stressed. I am beyond stressed.

02:32:43.254 --> 02:32:45.254
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Have a chat with him I am sure he will take your

02:32:50.795 --> 02:32:53.697
information and follow-up.
>> SPEAKER: Yes I have his carpet for my bottom line is

02:32:56.167 --> 02:32:58.167
this. There needs to be some loss for us. Because they

02:32:59.337 --> 02:33:01.337
say this falls under nuisance this is not a nuisance.

02:33:02.240 --> 02:33:04.240
This is beyond nuisance I don't even know what the

02:33:05.143 --> 02:33:07.143
definition of the word would be but it is not a

02:33:08.312 --> 02:33:10.312
nuisance but a nuisance is somebody that I don't know.

02:33:11.215 --> 02:33:13.215
This is not a nuisance when you walk up 7 o'clock in

02:33:14.652 --> 02:33:16.652
the morning your house is shaking and everybody is

02:33:17.255 --> 02:33:19.255
telling you what you expect we are building. So what do

02:33:20.458 --> 02:33:22.458
you have in place for as a citizen when they built to

02:33:23.928 --> 02:33:25.928
have the right to build that we have the right to

02:33:27.980 --> 02:33:29.980
maintain our property the way it was before they

02:33:29.700 --> 02:33:31.100
started?
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Okay, thank you. Yes, sir.

02:33:39.644 --> 02:33:41.644
Come on up you need to register but do that afterwards.

02:33:43.448 --> 02:33:45.448
You are the real last person and then we will wrap up.

02:33:47.218 --> 02:33:49.786
>> Sorry.
I said something online.

02:33:57.195 --> 02:33:59.195
>> What is your name, ma'am?

02:34:06.537 --> 02:34:08.537
We have your comments. >> Thank you for allowing me to speak my name is Ray

02:34:08.673 --> 02:34:11.740
Calypso have been the president of Congress civic
association more than 30 something years and we are

02:34:11.676 --> 02:34:13.577
only trying to help improve.
We do not get paid.

02:34:13.945 --> 02:34:15.945
One thing I feel about DPIE's they make good

02:34:19.350 --> 02:34:21.350
presentation when they come to the meeting.

02:34:23.588 --> 02:34:25.588
But after then they are caused we don't see them or

02:34:26.557 --> 02:34:28.358
don't hear them.
One particular situation is thisthis. We had a resident

02:34:34.265 --> 02:34:36.265
in our neighborhood 2105.

02:34:37.335 --> 02:34:39.335
With no permit with no consultation to neighbors or the

02:34:44.842 --> 02:34:46.610
Association.
Built what was first a shed. This shed was taller than his house.

02:34:48.346 --> 02:34:50.346
He added a patio the inspector came and said

02:34:51.415 --> 02:34:52.783
overwhelming.
I sat through the hearing and they tried to get him to

02:34:59.900 --> 02:35:01.900
do this or that nothing has been done.

02:35:03.995 --> 02:35:05.995
Why? I have been to meetings. I have had copies and the administrator I talked to

02:35:06.631 --> 02:35:07.898
documented.
I documented I do what I was supposed to do in a

02:35:10.434 --> 02:35:12.434
professional and and I have not gotten a response as of

02:35:13.671 --> 02:35:16.506
yet.
And I am trying to tell them this.
Trying to Prince George's County in these communities

02:35:22.513 --> 02:35:24.513
that are underrepresented.

02:35:25.149 --> 02:35:27.149
That we have been the last few years. Help us, that is all we are asking you to do.

02:35:31.656 --> 02:35:33.656
What this is done is this. This is divided neighbors. Had to find a way to get to

02:35:36.294 --> 02:35:38.294
these senior citizens who cannot get out who have done

02:35:40.164 --> 02:35:41.965
their work.
Who want to stay in their homes peacefully. This

02:35:44.402 --> 02:35:47.304
situation has been neighbors against
neighborsneighbors. I am 80 years old and these

02:35:49.340 --> 02:35:51.340
neighbors are afraid to come out of the house they

02:35:53.177 --> 02:35:55.177
would not even meet with me. They would give me

02:35:56.981 --> 02:35:58.981
information on my telephone and say you do this, you do

02:36:01.185 --> 02:36:03.185
this. I said I can't do it all. It hurts, it really

02:36:05.756 --> 02:36:07.756
hurts when people come to my neighborhood I want to see

02:36:09.994 --> 02:36:11.994
a beautiful neighborhood I want clean streets. We have

02:36:13.431 --> 02:36:15.431
claimed the streets I have personally.

02:36:15.733 --> 02:36:17.733
But no help, none. And when I call and you come to me

02:36:21.539 --> 02:36:23.539
and I say vote for this person, vote for this person

02:36:26.477 --> 02:36:28.477
but the only person who's helped us when she was here

02:36:31.415 --> 02:36:33.415
was ecksom, she is only one who helped.

02:36:34.986 --> 02:36:36.986
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Please sign up, sir.

02:36:41.692 --> 02:36:43.692
>> SPEAKER: I do have a picture of the shed. It is a

02:36:45.162 --> 02:36:47.162
beautiful picture, patio, window spread and you tell me

02:36:47.565 --> 02:36:49.900
that DPIE can't do anything?
Is this a shed or a dwelling?

02:36:56.807 --> 02:36:58.807
>> DONNA J. BROWN, CLERK: Thank you for coming out we

02:37:01.145 --> 02:37:03.145
spoke make sure you sign it. Right there the clerk.

02:37:05.820 --> 02:37:07.820
This issue is really troubling it is been brought to my

02:37:09.420 --> 02:37:11.420
attention. And as you mentioned it is escalated from a

02:37:13.391 --> 02:37:15.391
shed to a dwelling to air BNB type situation.

02:37:16.928 --> 02:37:18.828
And it started before I got here.
>> KRYSTAL ORIADHA: But it is unacceptable so I made

02:37:22.266 --> 02:37:24.266
myself clear. I think some of my colleagues have made

02:37:26.704 --> 02:37:28.704
themselves clear. I won't tolerate DPIE ignoring my

02:37:30.274 --> 02:37:32.274
district. That is not going to happen will have the

02:37:34.712 --> 02:37:36.712
opportunity to serve in this role. I expect better.

02:37:38.716 --> 02:37:40.150
Period.
We will be talking about this off-line but thank you.

02:37:43.955 --> 02:37:45.955
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: I want to thank you

02:37:50.962 --> 02:37:52.962
everybody I will turn to Mr. McCarthy will wrap up and

02:37:58.669 --> 02:38:00.669
address anything he wishes to touch on.

02:38:03.574 --> 02:38:05.574
>> JARED McCARTHY: Just want to thank you the residence for sharing concerns it is something the administration needs to consider. A lot of follow-up. And certainly we will be available for folks who want

02:38:06.444 --> 02:38:08.444
to talk after. Make sure we have your contact

02:38:09.130 --> 02:38:11.130
information so we can follow-up we will get a copy of

02:38:12.149 --> 02:38:14.149
the roster as well councilmember so we can follow-up.

02:38:14.719 --> 02:38:17.530
Thank you, everybody.
>> THOMAS E. DERNOGA, CHAIR: Thank you everybody for coming out we appreciate your
input.